Simulated OEI
Moderators: Rick, Lance Murray
- nworthin
- 3 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 145
- Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2020 11:12 pm
- First Name: Norm
- Aircraft Type: OTHER
- Aircraft Registration: N190AS
- Airports: KSRQ
- Has thanked: 14 times
- Been thanked: 115 times
Simulated OEI
I've heard, but it hasn't been confirmed, that 20% on the "dead" engine simulates a feathered single engine flight.
Can anyone confirm that?
I tried it today on my demo flight and it was incredibly benign. Barely any wing drop and, after I dialed in a bit of rudder trim, actually hard to tell one of the props "wasn't spinning".
I did a lousy job of getting VYse (too fast) but, even so, saw a couple hundred foot climb rate (4 on board, half fuel).
Frankly, this seemed too good to be true.
Can anyone confirm that?
I tried it today on my demo flight and it was incredibly benign. Barely any wing drop and, after I dialed in a bit of rudder trim, actually hard to tell one of the props "wasn't spinning".
I did a lousy job of getting VYse (too fast) but, even so, saw a couple hundred foot climb rate (4 on board, half fuel).
Frankly, this seemed too good to be true.
- shorton
- 2 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:42 pm
- First Name: Scott
- Aircraft Type: DA42NG
- Aircraft Registration: N68MJ
- Airports: KSNA
- Has thanked: 11 times
- Been thanked: 21 times
Re: Simulated OEI
I use 11% for zero thrust in our DA42NGs. I think 20% is clearly too much.
Scott Horton, JD CPA
ATP, FAA Gold Seal CFI, CFII, MEI
https://orangecountyflightinstruction.com
KSNA, Orange County, CA
ATP, FAA Gold Seal CFI, CFII, MEI
https://orangecountyflightinstruction.com
KSNA, Orange County, CA
- nworthin
- 3 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 145
- Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2020 11:12 pm
- First Name: Norm
- Aircraft Type: OTHER
- Aircraft Registration: N190AS
- Airports: KSRQ
- Has thanked: 14 times
- Been thanked: 115 times
Re: Simulated OEI
Seemed too high to me too....
I've seen that value quoted elsewhere. Need to dig into this as I will want to practice this but don't really want to do actual shutdowns/restarts if I can avoid it.
- NDCDA62
- 3 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 197
- Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 3:15 pm
- First Name: Nigel
- Aircraft Type: DA62
- Aircraft Registration: DINDC
- Airports: EDRY
- Has thanked: 83 times
- Been thanked: 117 times
Re: Simulated OEI
I was trained at DAI Wiener Neustadt and 20% was used to simulate the feathered engine in the DA62.
- CFIDave
- 5 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 2678
- Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:40 pm
- First Name: Dave
- Aircraft Type: OTHER
- Aircraft Registration: N333GX
- Airports: KJYO Leesburg VA
- Has thanked: 231 times
- Been thanked: 1473 times
Re: Simulated OEI
20% thrust is WAY too high to simulate a feathered engine. I suppose if you can get an examiner to accept that, it'll make passing your multi-engine checkride much easier.
I've always used 11% on Austro DA42s and DA62s. A disadvantage of this lower power setting is that the gear warning horn will continue to sound because the plane thinks you're going to land without lowering the gear. You may need to resort to temporarily pulling the gear warning (not the landing gear motor) circuit breaker.
I've always used 11% on Austro DA42s and DA62s. A disadvantage of this lower power setting is that the gear warning horn will continue to sound because the plane thinks you're going to land without lowering the gear. You may need to resort to temporarily pulling the gear warning (not the landing gear motor) circuit breaker.
Epic Aircraft E1000 GX
Former DA40XLS, DA42-VI, and DA62 owner
ATP, CFI, CFI-I, MEI
Former DA40XLS, DA42-VI, and DA62 owner
ATP, CFI, CFI-I, MEI
- nworthin
- 3 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 145
- Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2020 11:12 pm
- First Name: Norm
- Aircraft Type: OTHER
- Aircraft Registration: N190AS
- Airports: KSRQ
- Has thanked: 14 times
- Been thanked: 115 times
Re: Simulated OEI
As I said in my original post, that 20% setting seemed way too good. Although I got the plane trimmed up ok, my speeds were too fast and we were still climbing. I thought, wow, this plane is amazing on just one engine. But, I didn't really believe it was real. Not to be cynical, but maybe Diamond trains factory pilots this way to impress prospects (though to be fair, most other factory numbers are understated from what I have seen).CFIDave wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 12:27 am 20% thrust is WAY too high to simulate a feathered engine. I suppose if you can get an examiner to accept that, it'll make passing your multi-engine checkride much easier.
I've always used 11% on Austro DA42s and DA62s. A disadvantage of this lower power setting is that the gear warning horn will continue to sound because the plane thinks you're going to land without lowering the gear. You may need to resort to temporarily pulling the gear warning (not the landing gear motor) circuit breaker.
- ememic99
- 5 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 1078
- Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2014 10:31 am
- First Name: Emir
- Aircraft Type: DA42
- Aircraft Registration: SEMAD
- Airports: LDZA LDVA
- Has thanked: 203 times
- Been thanked: 390 times
Re: Simulated OEI
I'm pretty sure that 20% is too high but it turnes off gear warning horn and I guess that's the main reason why it's recommended for training. BTW when DA42 and DA62 were demonstrated to me, engine was shut-down and the numbers were better than in the POH although I can't be sure we were at MTOW.nworthin wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:00 amAs I said in my original post, that 20% setting seemed way too good. Although I got the plane trimmed up ok, my speeds were too fast and we were still climbing. I thought, wow, this plane is amazing on just one engine. But, I didn't really believe it was real. Not to be cynical, but maybe Diamond trains factory pilots this way to impress prospects (though to be fair, most other factory numbers are understated from what I have seen).CFIDave wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 12:27 am 20% thrust is WAY too high to simulate a feathered engine. I suppose if you can get an examiner to accept that, it'll make passing your multi-engine checkride much easier.
I've always used 11% on Austro DA42s and DA62s. A disadvantage of this lower power setting is that the gear warning horn will continue to sound because the plane thinks you're going to land without lowering the gear. You may need to resort to temporarily pulling the gear warning (not the landing gear motor) circuit breaker.
- NDCDA62
- 3 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 197
- Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 3:15 pm
- First Name: Nigel
- Aircraft Type: DA62
- Aircraft Registration: DINDC
- Airports: EDRY
- Has thanked: 83 times
- Been thanked: 117 times
Re: Simulated OEI
During training at DAI Weiner Neustadt we, of course, performed a complete shutdown of the left engine.
- ultraturtle
- 4 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 300
- Joined: Fri Mar 31, 2017 2:46 pm
- First Name: Rob
- Aircraft Type: DA62
- Aircraft Registration: N62KZ
- Airports: KAAF
- Has thanked: 64 times
- Been thanked: 180 times
Re: Simulated OEI
Just to be super picky, if 11% works for the DA42NG, 10% might be a better number for the DA62. 11% of 168hp = 18.5hp.
10% of 180hp = 18hp, which is a bit closer to 18.5 than 19.8, plus the DA62 has slightly larger props, which means a bit more drag when feathered.
10% of 180hp = 18hp, which is a bit closer to 18.5 than 19.8, plus the DA62 has slightly larger props, which means a bit more drag when feathered.
- CFIDave
- 5 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 2678
- Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:40 pm
- First Name: Dave
- Aircraft Type: OTHER
- Aircraft Registration: N333GX
- Airports: KJYO Leesburg VA
- Has thanked: 231 times
- Been thanked: 1473 times
Re: Simulated OEI
If you want to determine the approximate % power for simulating a feathered engine in your airplane, try determining it experimentally:
1. Shut down and feather the left (critical) engine (for up to 2 minutes, or up to 10 minutes for an Austro engine if OAT is above -5C). While doing this, fly straight and hold altitude, with about 2.5 degree right bank ("raise the dead") and with 1/2 "ball" slip indicator, with the right engine operating at something like 75% power. Note the right engine power % you selected and the resulting stabilized IAS.
2. With both engines operating, set the right engine to the same % power setting as above. Then -- flying straight and holding altitude as above -- bring the left (simulated feathered) engine power back to 11% or so, until the stabilized IAS matches what you achieved with the left engine actually feathered. Note the resulting left engine % power -- that's what you should use to simulate a feathered engine.
I suppose you could do the same thing using the right engine instead of the left, or not worry too much about the bank angle or yaw/slip -- as long as you do the same thing for both 1 and 2 above. Consistency is what's important.
1. Shut down and feather the left (critical) engine (for up to 2 minutes, or up to 10 minutes for an Austro engine if OAT is above -5C). While doing this, fly straight and hold altitude, with about 2.5 degree right bank ("raise the dead") and with 1/2 "ball" slip indicator, with the right engine operating at something like 75% power. Note the right engine power % you selected and the resulting stabilized IAS.
2. With both engines operating, set the right engine to the same % power setting as above. Then -- flying straight and holding altitude as above -- bring the left (simulated feathered) engine power back to 11% or so, until the stabilized IAS matches what you achieved with the left engine actually feathered. Note the resulting left engine % power -- that's what you should use to simulate a feathered engine.
I suppose you could do the same thing using the right engine instead of the left, or not worry too much about the bank angle or yaw/slip -- as long as you do the same thing for both 1 and 2 above. Consistency is what's important.
Epic Aircraft E1000 GX
Former DA40XLS, DA42-VI, and DA62 owner
ATP, CFI, CFI-I, MEI
Former DA40XLS, DA42-VI, and DA62 owner
ATP, CFI, CFI-I, MEI