New airplane prices

[Rich]

First of all, unlike many members here, I have neither the need nor desire to upgrade to a "more capable" plane than my 2002 DA40. It's completely suited to what I want in an airplane.

But just for grins, I added up my best estimate of what I paid for ALL houses, airplanes (including my DA40), cars and motorcycles over my 66 years. (In the interest of disclosure, though I bought the DA40 new and it was "loaded" for the time, it was priced far lower than they are now.)

It totals less than the list price of a well-equipped 2013 SR22T with FIKI.

This isn't to pick on Cirrus in particular, as there are lots of planes in this 730K+ range for which this is equally true.

just sayin'...

[alexanderk]

Lucky you! Some of us ended up living in places where a rat-hole small house costs that much. You can only guess why there is less disposable income left for the motorcycles, cars and good airplanes! The call sign on my da20 is .-.NSF!

Also I suppose Diamond would have sold ALOT more DA40s if they kept the prices in check. I don't think I am alone who can buy a new 40, but does not see it as a sensible thing to do at the price it is offered. Ends up being a dead-end pun intended.

[Steven]

I agree, new aircraft prices are out of hand. I suspect that nearly all new SR22's are being bought for "business purposes" (wink, wink) and they are taking advantage of favorable tax treatment associated with accelerated depreciation. It would be interesting to look at the number of new SR22's registered to private individuals. I'll bet it is a tiny number.

I thought Diamond was going to take over light GA when they introduced the Katana for $88,000 new. But for some reason I guess that business model did not work out for them.

[alexanderk]

Make it 100k for a new Katana - I'll take two! Seriously.
Make DA40 new under 300k, I'll take one.

Until then I suspect I'l be buying used... and that's how people end up with a brand different than the Diamonds.

[Rich]

Make it 100k for a new Katana - I'll take two! Seriously.
Make DA40 new under 300k, I'll take one.

Until then I suspect I'l be buying used... and that's how people end up with a brand different than the Diamonds.

Without attracting buyers of new planes there are no used plane to purchase. My point is that it's easy to be dissuaded from buying a new plane.

LSA'a are an embarrassment. If it weren't for the aging pilot population concerned about their likelihood of passing their next medical, the market would be cut in half. The typical $130,000 LSA has about the same carrying capacity and range as my $8,000 motorcycle.

[bcocheran]

Make it 100k for a new Katana - I'll take two! Seriously.
Make DA40 new under 300k, I'll take one.

Until then I suspect I'l be buying used... and that's how people end up with a brand different than the Diamonds.

Without attracting buyers of new planes there are no used plane to purchase. My point is that it's easy to be dissuaded from buying a new plane.

LSA'a are an embarrassment. If it weren't for the aging pilot population concerned about their likelihood of passing their next medical, the market would be cut in half. The typical $130,000 LSA has about the same carrying capacity and range as my $8,000 motorcycle.

Hey rich! I do not have the same experience with LSA. It is part of what makes me frustrated with GA in general. I just purchased a brand new LSA for $125k and it has the carrying capacity of my DA40 within 50lbs. Very near the same range is well!

It is certified in Australia with more useful load than me diamond by 200lbs!




Brad - 216DG - 40.698 (G1000) - KELK

[pilotpaul]

Hey rich! I do not have the same experience with LSA. It is part of what makes me frustrated with GA in general. I just purchased a brand new LSA for $125k and it has the carrying capacity of my DA40 within 50lbs. Very near the same range is well!

Sounds too good to be true.
LSA max gross takeoff weight is 1200 lbs.
As an example we can use DA-40 that has useful load of 880 lbs.
So if we assume that LSA has 50 lbs less useful load than DA-40 then that LSA has max empty weight of 1200-(880-50)=370 lbs.
Either this LSA is a parachute or that DA-40 comes with three passengers "pre-installed".

It is certified in Australia with more useful load than me diamond by 200lbs!

This one does not even make sense. How much that LSA weights? 100lbs?

[Rich]

LSA MTOW in the US is 1320 lbs. Looking at a chart of numerous LSA, there are some up over 600 lb useful load. But that's still way less than my current useful load of 825 lbs. And full fuel payload for me is 585. With pending OSB installation, these numbers will become 935 and 695, respectively.

In any case I can put two people on my current MC, carry at least as much gear than the typical LSA and drive 250 miles with reserves. My previous bike could do 350 miles on a tank with reserves.

[bcocheran]

My DA40 has 750lbs useful on POH W&B.
1/2 fuel leaves only 600lbs
Full fuel and only 450lbs left
MTOW 2535 on DA40
1785 empty

LSA P92
730 empty
1320 MTOW
= 590 useful (wishful thinking, huh?)
Fuel fuel (26 gal is 156lbs) = 434 lbs
I CAN HAUL NEARLY AS MUCH FULL OF FUEL WITH MY DIAMOND!!!!
It burns 3.5GPH and has a range within 100NM of my diamond!
Weight limitation on the P92 is limited by its class on the US, not its design!
1900MTOW in other countries.

Diamond can do better!



Brad - N216DG - KELK
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[pilotpaul]

Yes, numbers look awful. However, I just looked at P92 and it looks like an ugly brother of Cessna 162 which itself does not look good either.
Bristell (useful load 570) or SportCruiser (useful load 498) would be better airplanes to compare. I've seem SportCruiser up close and it looked to me like a real airplane and not a pathetic cessna clone. You know, with real seats and interior that was not made of cardboard

On the other hand I do not understand why glass panels and leather seats weigh so much.