Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

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TwinStarScott
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Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Post by TwinStarScott »

Good to know Emir and thanks!
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Colin
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Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Post by Colin »

I would like to point out the current Diamond and the previous Diamond should be thought of as different companies. (Cirrus went through the same thing and there was an uncomfortable moment when the new owners were not as interested in being transparent with their owner-pilots.)

(The old Diamond: When my new autopilot was installed my airspeed indicator was replaced. When I asked why I was told the v-speeds had changed and they needed to be shown on the standby airspeed indicator. I was trying to get home so I didn't ask any other questions, but the airframe and engines were not changed. There *might* have been a little weight and balance change. So I am not that inspired by the old Diamond's interest in certification.)

I wish we had better outreach to the few hundred DA42 owners in North America. It feels like we have too small a fraction of them represented on here.
Colin Summers, PP Multi-Engine IFR, ~3,000hrs
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N971RD DA40 G1000 s/n 40.508 (traded)
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NickBudd
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Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Post by NickBudd »

I think the company was traumatized by the life-threatening Thielert problem and the personal animosity between Christian Dries and Frank Thielert which kept them from merging, which was the sensible thing to do. Once Dries decided to bet the company on developing Austro engines, all energy focused on encouraging customers to buy or switch to Austro engines and TDI owners had to be pushed under the bus. There is no reason why the new owners should feel differently, since DA42 TDIs have not been built for the past ten years. It probably makes more sense to push Continental/Technify to lend some level of technical support, since they need to encourage the 250 TDI owners to buy replacement engines from them, however this seems a long shot since these engines are already very competitive in cost compared to the Austro.

It would be nice the have WAAS and the other Garmin goodies but basically I think the DA42 TDI is perfectly OK for all of the reasons I bought mine eight years ago. However I will happily sign any petitions to Garmin or to Diamond (or to the FTC if someone wants to claim that Diamond's unreasonable insistence that owners buy Austro engines in order to upgrade to WAAS is an illegal tie-in under Section 5 of the FTC Act).
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TwinStarScott
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Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Post by TwinStarScott »

An interesting, yet painful history lesson from both Colin and Nick! The Federal Trade Commission Act that Nick brings up is something that hadn't occurred to me - as is the Continental / Technify angle.

Even us disgruntled owners have to feel somewhat sympathetic for the new ownership, as they inherited a public relations problem (nightmare?). One would imagine they were well aware of it before stepping in and the associated costs it brought. So it probably goes without saying that all corporations facing PR issues know it's going to be costly – in whatever manner they decide to (eventually) address the matter. HOWEVER, let's stress Colin's point here by giving the “new” and hopefully much improved Diamond Aircraft the benefit of the doubt – by honoring the time frame Emir mentioned just a few posts ago. Not that any owner has to follow my advice, but my suggestion would be for us owners (in this thread) to hold off on exploring any type of adversarial options until early 2019. AND that this type of discussion will never need to take place because the management at Diamond will soon make a decision(s) we all can live with.

So for now, let's focus on getting more owner's to join this petition as well as ways to engage in a collaborative fashion with the new management - as it is clearly the superior option for them and us.

Thanks Nick for being willing to be lucky number 13, may this be a good omen for you and this effort:

13. Nick N483TS DA42
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Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Post by TimS »

NickBudd wrote: It would be nice the have WAAS and the other Garmin goodies but basically I think the DA42 TDI is perfectly OK for all of the reasons I bought mine eight years ago. However I will happily sign any petitions to Garmin or to Diamond (or to the FTC if someone wants to claim that Diamond's unreasonable insistence that owners buy Austro engines in order to upgrade to WAAS is an illegal tie-in under Section 5 of the FTC Act).
Nick,

Intellectual curiosity. How does that work? Even as a news junky I have never heard of that section being used recently. The only instance I know is a vague recollection of FTC using it against IBM in the 60s to break apart the OS software from the HW to allow Amdhal and others to compete.

Tim
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Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Post by Charles K »

I'm in for my 2004 DA40 - need updates - why they abandoned non-WAAS boggles me. How hard could it be for them to tweak the WAAS SW for us early adopters. As the DA40 2004 was the first launch platform for the G1000 I find it particularly frustrating to those of us that took the leap and trusted Garmin.
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TwinStarScott
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Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Post by TwinStarScott »

Great Charles! Thank you.

14. Charles N5WU DA40

How about you Timothy – can we add your name to the list too?
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TimS
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Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Post by TimS »

ScottSutton wrote:Great Charles! Thank you.

14. Charles N5WU DA40

How about you Timothy – can we add your name to the list too?
If talking to me, I do not own a Diamond. I have rented them, and almost bought a DA-42 twice. The last time was six months ago, I had the financing arranged, as about to engage a buyer agent; and then found out the lack of upgrade paths on the G1000. I want WAAS and a WAAS equipped DA-42 was outside the budget. So, I joined a two others and bought an older SR22 instead. I really prefer the DA-42 and so does my wife, so I hope the problem is resolved when I am ready to buy again in three to five years (this is how long my partners and I expect to keep the Cirrus).

Tim
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TwinStarScott
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Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Post by TwinStarScott »

My apologies Tim, since starting this thread I've spent way more time than usual this weekend in front of a computer screen and my eyes have long since glazed over here late Sunday night.

Although your story has sparked an idea – which is to still add your name to this list, with a brief footnote explaining something to the effect (current Cirrus owner, would prefer and eventually plans on owning a DA42 - pending the assurance of long term and ongoing software support. Also, aircraft must be equipped with WAAS for LPV approach capability).

Your thoughts? Will hold off on doing so, pending the green light from you.

Finally, it seems we (I) should also be encouraging and capturing pilots in the “Other – Aircraft” category, with similar stories. Meaning those who are holding off on such a purchase until this G1000 dilemma gets addressed.
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Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Post by NickBudd »

Tim, the way it works is you write a letter to the enforcement division of the FTC in Washington and they decide whether to pursue it under their current policies. These actions are only publicised if a court proceeding is required. The argument here would probably be that although the impact on commerce is minimal, it is unreasonable because it is a safety issue for operators and the public. I am not an antitrust expert but my guess is that under normal conditions the likelihood that the FTC would devote resources to investigating a claim for 250 aircraft owners is small to none, however considering what is going on with China maybe the fact that Diamond is Chinese-owned and has no manufacturing in the US could get someone’s attention. If Diamond receives a notice that the FTC is launching an investigation I’m sure Diamond would react immediately. Another thought, maybe there is a Diamond owner in Oklahoma that could write to Sen Inhofe who might be willing to write to the FTC (aviation/safety issue/Chinese company). That would be sure to get the attention of the FTC.
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