Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

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ememic99
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Re: Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

Post by ememic99 »

Boatguy wrote: Sat Jun 15, 2019 3:49 pm I don't have a "legacy" G1000, or at least I hope not for awhile, and I don't fully understand the various variations of avionics configurations dating back to the original G1000 pre-WAAS configurations.
If you have GIA63W (and not GIA64W) then you already have legacy avionics. Of course you're in much better position than the owners who have old non-WAAS G1000 and KAP140 but, with such attitude of DAI, it's just question of time when you'll simply not be able to get any new feature (SW or HW).
I think the general request is "keep our software current and give us a hardware upgrade path as hardware evolves". But beyond that, is it possible to articulate 3-4 specific requests that would satisfy the majority of owners on the petition?
It is possible and it's communicated to DAI but without any official response.

1. Is there a plan of releasing newer version of G1000 software for older airframes?
2. Is there a plan to offer legacy G1000 owners an opportunity to upgrade hardware (maybe NXi) in order to be able to run newest software?
3. Is there a plan to offer legacy G1000 owners WAAS upgrade?
4. Is there a plan to offer legacy G1000 owners autopilot upgrade replacing KAP140?

All these should be done without forcing owners to switch to AE300 engines and all of these should be available in authorized shops, not only in the factory. The issue is that 3 and 4 were available at one point in the time (although at ridiculously high price and only in Diamond factory facilities) but now they are not available at all.
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ememic99
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Re: Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

Post by ememic99 »

Rick wrote: Sat Jun 15, 2019 3:57 pm If Diamond would just produce a software update that included the latest G1000 base software version, I think that would fix most of the problems.
How? And what problems would be fixed?

Latest version of SW, that works on legacy G1000, works without any known problem (AFAIK). Otherwise, there would be some AD issued and DAI would have to fix the problem.

I don't think that enabling few features here and there (like enabling logging flight data on DA42 which is not available on legacy G1000) would solve anything. And even if DAI issues such new SW, I think it's very questionable how this would operate on old HW with low processing power and low memory capacity.

Our main problem is WAAS and the second big issue is KAP140.
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Re: Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

Post by Rick »

New base software doesn't just add a few new features (although it does do that, too!). It enables an easier path to ADS-B for those with existing WAAS, a path to add WAAS for others where currently not possible, the ability to fly some RNAV approaches that are off limits now (like the RNAV24 at my home base), etc. As far as replacing the KAP140 goes, that is a whole different problem...
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ememic99
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Re: Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

Post by ememic99 »

Rick wrote: Sat Jun 15, 2019 4:49 pm It enables an easier path to ADS-B for those with existing WAAS
Those with WAAS are not the problem because they already have newer base software (and probably hardware - I don’t know about other components but they at least have GIA63W).
a path to add WAAS for others where currently not possible
How can this be done without replacing GIA63?

I’m still pretty sure that software upgrade only doesn’t bring much and if anybody thinks differently I would like to see clear explanation.
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Charles K
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Re: Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

Post by Charles K »

I like many fly an 04 non WAAS G1000 DA40 w KAP140.

My friend flies a Columbia 400 2007 and paid about 30K to upgrade to WAAS. He is in the same trap as us with regards to SW.

He always reminds me that Cirrus has a wonderful legacy avionics and SW support program - perhaps partially explaining their market dominance.

I recently flew a brand new G6 SR22T - of course too much $$$ for me - but it is an absolutely amazing aircraft and I felt the flight controls were quite good going into it preparing to be disappointing. The safety features built into the SW and coupled with the GFC 700 is nothing short of remarkable - I think it really obviates the need for the chute (yes I know it needs the chute as part of its certification).

While I could upgrade my DA40 to a newer one to get the GFC700 and WAAS - I keep thinking about a used SR20 with the 12 inch screens and WAAS and GFC700.

I am on the petition and hope they listen - but am not hopeful.
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TwinStarScott
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Re: Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

Post by TwinStarScott »

Our main problem is WAAS and the second big issue is KAP140.
Back to the question posed by Russ from yesterday - one item that has come to my attention since the formation of the G1000 petition. And that is: if there was one really important software feature the NXi and other Garmin Systems have* and the legacy systems do not, it would just have to be the visual approach feature. Why?

Because this feature, along with LPV approaches, will continue to save countless lives. If you've ever known even just one pilot that died due to a “black hole” accident or botched non-precision approach - it stresses the need for a timely solution for all legacy G1000 aircraft. In the two cases I'm thinking about, six souls would be alive today had this technology been available back in the early 1990's. A handful of other tragic accidents come to mind just off the top of my head. So this is clearly a deadly serious topic and for TAA not to be able to keep reasonably in stride with current advances in technology, it's simply just not right.

So my suggestion is for:
Diamond and Garmin to figure out how to make this feature available and affordable for all legacy aircraft. An idea I hear floated frequently is for the WAAS box in the GTX-345R's to be TSO'd and really why not? The other remaining question is: can the legacy software be upgraded to allow for this feature to be added. On the surface, it sure seems possible. If not, provide an affordable hardware solution that is.

One question that perhaps an NXi owner can weigh in here – is it possible to load a visual approach to airports / runways that do not even have a standard instrument approach?

Regardless, the bottom line from my perspective is: MAKE IT AVAILABLE, MAKE IT AFFORDABLE. And without access to crucial features such as this one, should legacy G1000 Diamonds still be considered fully TAA at this point?

* to name just one other one – the G3X touch displays driven by either the GTN 650/750 / GNX375 or GPS175.
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Re: Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

Post by NickBudd »

It would be a big step forward if Diamond would cooperate with Garmin to put DA42 tdi's on parity with NGs and -VIs for hardware and software improvements. This is a flight safety issue would require very little, if any, additional time and investment by Diamond.
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Re: Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

Post by ememic99 »

visual approach
I’m sorry but I don’t understand the importance of this feature. Can you explain it a bit further?
Last edited by ememic99 on Sun Jun 16, 2019 7:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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ememic99
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Re: Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

Post by ememic99 »

NickBudd wrote: Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:57 pm It would be a big step forward if Diamond would cooperate with Garmin to put DA42 tdi's on parity with NGs and -VIs for hardware and software improvements. This is a flight safety issue would require very little, if any, additional time and investment by Diamond.
I definitely agree with you because there used to deliver DA42 TDI with GFC700, so no flight testing for STC is needed. WAAS upgrade both for such TDI and for KAP140 based TDI was also available. So paperwork for upgrading DA42 TDI with legacy G1000 should be pretty easy.
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Re: Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

Post by Boatguy »

TwinStarScott wrote: Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:30 pm One question that perhaps an NXi owner can weigh in here – is it possible to load a visual approach to airports / runways that do not even have a standard instrument approach?
I can only speak to the DA40 NG, but there are a number of features that are part of the G1000 NXi that have not been implemented by Diamond in either Phase 1 or Phase 2, including Visual Approaches and Surface Watch, both available on Textron aircraft for over two years.

The Cirrus version (Perspective +) of NXi additionally adds Electronic Stability Protection, Level button, yaw damper (optional) and dual AHRS.
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