The MAM came out in October 2018, so that may be the case. Has anyone having taken delivery of an Austro powered Diamond in 2019 or later seen a factory windmill start documented?ememic99 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 29, 2020 10:13 pmI'd say that the test at your aircraft was performed before related SB/AD was issued, so I'd say 900 hrs limit applies to your engines. I believe they don't do these tests anymore and they won't do them until they re-introduce windmilling restart as normal procedure again.ultraturtle wrote: ↑Sun Nov 29, 2020 4:48 pm Paging through the mountain of documents chronicling the construction of my 2017 DA62 (which has the same Chapter 4 limitations as the DA42-VI), I discovered that a windmilling start was accomplished by a factory pilot as part of the routine test process, before the initial airworthiness certificate was issued. Does this mean my aircraft (and I assume all Austro engined Diamonds, having been similarly tested) must have the timing chain replaced at 900 hrs, or does the clock start when the factory releases the aircraft to the initial owner?
DA42-6 Airworthiness Limitations / Engine TBO
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- ultraturtle
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Re: DA42-6 Airworthiness Limitations / Engine TBO
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Re: DA42-6 Airworthiness Limitations / Engine TBO
I used to perform windmilling restarts all the time when I owned a DA42-VI, both for flight training and for sales demos. It's the easiest way to restart an Austro engine in flight, and it didn't appear to damage my engines at all.
But a few years ago Diamond/Austro discovered that windmilling restarts would damage the timing chain, and prohibited the practice except for an emergency -- use of the electric starter is now the accepted way to restart Austro engines in flight. This has been reflected in the latest AFMs for both the DA42 and DA62, and an AD for timing chain replacement was issued that applies to all aircraft that have experienced windmilling restarts.
Personally, I wouldn't worry about a factory windmilling restart that might have been performed before your plane's airworthiness certificate was issued. Only Austrian-built DA42s and DA62s are even supplied with a record of their factory test flights; Canadian-built planes aren't delivered with these documents. If you do find evidence of a factory windmilling restart, are you going to try and get Diamond/Austro to pay for a timing chain replacement that would otherwise not be required?
But a few years ago Diamond/Austro discovered that windmilling restarts would damage the timing chain, and prohibited the practice except for an emergency -- use of the electric starter is now the accepted way to restart Austro engines in flight. This has been reflected in the latest AFMs for both the DA42 and DA62, and an AD for timing chain replacement was issued that applies to all aircraft that have experienced windmilling restarts.
Personally, I wouldn't worry about a factory windmilling restart that might have been performed before your plane's airworthiness certificate was issued. Only Austrian-built DA42s and DA62s are even supplied with a record of their factory test flights; Canadian-built planes aren't delivered with these documents. If you do find evidence of a factory windmilling restart, are you going to try and get Diamond/Austro to pay for a timing chain replacement that would otherwise not be required?
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Re: DA42-6 Airworthiness Limitations / Engine TBO
I agree that a single restart prior to delivery of the aircraft is probably not much to worry about from a safety perspective. But, I'm not sure that matters if the AD specifies that the timing chain must be changed even for a single occurance.
I guess the question is whether an A&P/IA would sign-off the aircraft as airworthy if they find this evidence and if the replacement hadn't been done as specified in the AD? Where is the pre-delivery testing documented for Austria-built aircraft? In the official logs? If so, it seems like the owner might get stuck with complying with the AD.If you do find evidence of a factory windmilling restart, are you going to try and get Diamond/Austro to pay for a timing chain replacement that would otherwise not be required?
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Re: DA42-6 Airworthiness Limitations / Engine TBO
Only Austrian-built Diamonds are delivered with a 3-ring binder full of pages documenting the testing that was done at the factory before delivery. It's not part of the aircraft logbooks and has no legal standing. So it's never given to A&P/IA techs when annual inspections are performed or they check ADs.
I had no idea that the factory performed windmilling restarts before delivery, and I've never looked hard enough in the reams of info in the binder to find this out for my aircraft.
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Re: DA42-6 Airworthiness Limitations / Engine TBO
Yes. And that’s why OP got documentation related to pre-delivery testing while @CFIDave didn’t with his DA62 built in Canada.
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Re: DA42-6 Airworthiness Limitations / Engine TBO
Actually my 2017 DA62 was also built in Wiener Neustadt Austria, before Diamond Canada had started its own DA62 production line in 2018. So I've also got a thick binder showing all of the pre-delivery testing that was performed by the Austrian factory.
At this point in late 2020 most DA62s for North/South American customers are being produced in Canada, but a few new Austrian DA62s are also ferried across the Atlantic from Wiener Neustadt -- which is where *ALL* DA42s continue to be built.
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- austropilot
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Re: DA42-6 Airworthiness Limitations / Engine TBO
No smoked sausages there, only Diamonds
Wiener Neustadt (Wien = german/austrian for Vienna, Wiener Neustadt = Viennese Newcity in a direct word by word translation).
Wiener Neustadt (Wien = german/austrian for Vienna, Wiener Neustadt = Viennese Newcity in a direct word by word translation).
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Re: DA42-6 Airworthiness Limitations / Engine TBO
Not sure that is right.austropilot wrote: ↑Fri Oct 16, 2020 12:22 pm which legally offers the owner/operator to deviate from manufacturer recommendations. Only AD's and airworthiness limitations need to be respected.
As I read it you have to comply with time limits even if they are not declared as airworthiness limitations.
See attached snippet.
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Re: DA42-6 Airworthiness Limitations / Engine TBO
No. Only ADs and Airworthiness Limitations are mandatory.