Inset Map

Any DA42 related topics.

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Re: Inset Map

Post by CFIDave » Fri May 24, 2019 12:45 pm

Scott: here's what I think is going on:

Lycoming DA40s running .23 software on their Legacy G1000s (which requires WAAS GIA63Ws) can display ADS-B IN weather as well as traffic on their G1000 displays, after installation of a GTX345R. It's then possible to select between weather sources (i.e. SXM GDL69A satellite weather vs. ADS-B IN weather from the GTX345R) on the G1000 by going into the Menu. This is also how it works on G1000 NXi.

Non-WAAS Lycoming DA40s that can't run .23 (i.e., only up to .22) can't display ADS-B IN weather on their PFD/MFD displays despite GTX345R installation, and this may also be the case for DA42 TDI aircraft.
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Re: Inset Map

Post by cptndavid » Fri May 24, 2019 2:35 pm

I can not display ADS-B in WX on my PDF/ MFD with the G T X 345 R installed. This is in my TDI aircraft. Therefore Dave you are correct.
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Re: Inset Map

Post by rdrobson » Fri May 24, 2019 4:19 pm

Colin wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 8:29 pm
(There's a lot of information online about this, but the data is definitely NOT live. That's not anything like having radar. It has to be collated, stitched together compressed, and moved to the upload sites. So I think the moment you get it the US data is something like fifteen minutes old. With convective activity, especially the powerful stuff we're trying to stay out of, that's a long time.)
You're right that the data is not live, but it's not 15 minutes old either. XM recently (a year ago??) updated their refresh rate and shortly after they did I was flying to KUGN which had convective activity all around it. It was a relatively clear day and the thunderstorms were numerous but isolated and not large. Chicago Center basically gave me crop dusting vectors as we waited for a storm to pass Waukegan. ATC and I were able to closely coordinate movement between cells and after 20 minutes or so was able to drop in between two cells passing the field and get down. I was very impressed with XM after that since it was showing me these cells that were behind me while I was passing time. It was a good day to judge performance as I had 3 sources of information, XM, ATC and what I could see out the windshield.

I would definitely not rely on XM to take me through a solid line of thunderstorms, but it works great for keeping in the clear air at a proper distance.

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Re: Inset Map

Post by TwinStarScott » Fri May 24, 2019 11:24 pm

I would definitely not rely on XM to take me through a solid line of thunderstorms, but it works great for keeping in the clear air at a proper distance.
Good advice for sure Ron! 

With the proper distance most commonly stated as a bare minimum of 25 miles away from any convective activity. Which I interpret to be from the edges of any red returns and ideally all yellow returns - would you agree? Although I even heard 50 miles is minimum from one highly respected source and to also pay close attention to the gradient of color changes.

Any additional thoughts you can share on "proper distance" and your general strategies for thunderstorm avoidance would be much appreciated. 

As for the great input from CFI Dave regarding the GTX-345R / FIS- B Wx variables, let's see if I've got this right:

To access FIS-B Wx on a legacy G1000, it requires two things:

1) a WAAS box GIA63W*
2) software version 370.23 or higher (while also implying GDU version 12.05, or higher?)

Being able to switch Wx sources as Dave outlined, would be an additional input in Ron's scenario. But this could also be done with a portable ADS-B unit and an ipad (too), as a real-time XM Wx to ADS-B Wx test would be nice to have, so as to be able to compare and contrast the two competing Wx sources.

As a result of today's discussion and where Doug's initial question has taken us, here's a fairly recent video on the subject of ADS-B vs XM Wx, that I intent to review again (since it was first published several months ago):
https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all ... r-siriusxm

Finally, my avionics shop concurs with David's experience - that our DA42 TDI's will NOT display FIS-B Wx. Stated another way, a GTX-345R installation only provides traffic-in data for this make and model, while complying with the 2020 ADS-B out mandate. 

*what I understand from Garmin is further engineering would most likely be required to have an NXi / GIA64W play with the KAP-140 A/P – should this upgrade ever be offered.
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Re: Inset Map

Post by jb642DA » Sat May 25, 2019 2:32 am

"Any additional thoughts you can share on "proper distance" and your general strategies for thunderstorm avoidance would be much appreciated."



Here's an "additional thought" - Know where the upwind side of any storm is located. Wind info is a great feature on our G1000 displays - always pay attention to it!

Here's another oldie but goodie - Don't ever fly under the anvil!

For an "official reference" versus individual opinions check out this PDF from the FAA - first 10 pages are interestiong to know things. Pages 11-13 have some good basic "Do's and Dont's"
https://www.faa.gov/documentlibrary/med ... 00-24c.pdf

Don't get into a situation where you are "stuck" having to penetrate a TRW (bottom of page 12 of above PDF - YIKES)
I still remember a "mission statement" from 30+ years ago when I was in the USAF -
"There is no peacetime mission that requires the penetration of a thunderstorm!"
(note the word "peacetime"! - more YIKES)

Here is another short article - "8 Tips For Flying Around Thunderstorms"
https://www.boldmethod.com/blog/lists/2 ... derstorms/

Ps: FIS-B / XM is great for strategic planning - never trust the data for tactical (close in) planning/maneuvering.
Last edited by jb642DA on Sat May 25, 2019 2:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Inset Map

Post by pietromarx » Sat May 25, 2019 2:41 am

ScottSutton wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 6:51 am
Well, that is most interesting Peter (to say the least)! Since it sounds as if you're quite familiar with a large number of DA40 and DA42 legacy G1000 installations - do you happen to work in an avionics shop?

Also, regarding your point No. 3 - by what means is the FIS-B / ADS-B Wx actually being displayed on your G1000?

More specifically:

- what version of GDU software are you running*?

- did you install any additional hardware* to be able to pull off this feat?

- did you remove your GDL-69 or GDL-69A?

- if no, then with an active SiriusXM Wx subscription, is it possible to toggle between the two G1000 Wx sources?

- is there any advice you can provide to those of us with GTX-345R's, who aren't able to display FIS-B Wx, on how best to remedy this situation?

Thanks!

* as I've was always been led to believe BOTH software and hardware were limiting factors here.
I think this has been covered with subsequent replies but I'm referencing later software and other non DA42TDI installations.

In any case there is clearly a lot of confusion around these things. I had one of the very earliest G1000 installations and have one of the current ones now. A lot of time spent on the innards. Not to be annoying, I can also say I'm very familiar with the inventors of and most of the technologies we are discussing and the services and products built around them.

To your question the fundamental issue is one of software, not hardware. The systems and sensors are all fine but the software is antiquated due to issues we know (ownership, focus, relations, etc.).

We are not talking about anything other than software features that have been developed and distributed widely, but not to you for your airplanes. Annoying to be sure.
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Re: Inset Map

Post by TwinStarScott » Sat May 25, 2019 2:49 am

Know where the upwind side of any storm is located. Wind info is a great feature on our G1000 displays - always pay attention to it!
That's awesome John - thank you for the great advice and links!

As luck would have it, I recently stumbled across the free "Bold Method" videos on youtube and found them to be a good IFR refresher on Holding Patterns* (2) and DME arcs (1). Will most definitely watch the "8 tips for Flying Around Thunderstorms" on their website.

* 1 of 2 holding pattern videos = https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0s1I5ymBmsU
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Re: Inset Map

Post by jb642DA » Sat May 25, 2019 2:55 am

Hi Scott -

Since you mentioned holding patterns and DME arcs - here are some decent youtube "resources" - I've sent the following to a couple of forum members via PM -


Here is a link to a very good G1000 youtube series. There are 17 8-12 minute "mini lessons" on various G1000 subjects -
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... t7UQb2D1kG


Another good video series is called "Six Sacred Skills" - the series is from the "COPA University" (provided by the Cirrus Owners and Pilots Association). Most of the info is good for our use also.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRvmLzM ... mR5yBaY157
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Re: Inset Map

Post by jb642DA » Sat May 25, 2019 3:02 am

Will most definitely watch the "8 tips for Flying Around Thunderstorms" on their website.

That is actually a web page - quick read!
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Re: Inset Map

Post by pietromarx » Sat May 25, 2019 3:13 am

jb642DA wrote:
Sat May 25, 2019 3:02 am
Will most definitely watch the "8 tips for Flying Around Thunderstorms" on their website.
The Bold Method stuff is getting quite good. Love their quizzes. Sometimes a little sobering, but very good.

Wouldn't the basic advice of any of us flying around thunderstorms is ... don't? :) I write this as a Californian who sees them rarely.
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