How to plan a fuel stop?

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DiamondRob
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How to plan a fuel stop?

Post by DiamondRob »

Im loving the diamond forums. Enjoying the reading, learning and scrolling! :mrgreen:

I hope no one minds a series of newbie questions - whilst I dont even have my PPL and am perfectly capable of googling the answer to most things (I do a lot of that already) I sometimes perfer to just ask those who already know and enjoy reading the answers.

This might be obvious to most of you, but how does a pilot plan an international fuel stop, or any fuel stop for that matter?

Lets say I had ten friends in different countries and wanted to visit them all, and each flight would require refuelling in a third country en ruote, how does a private pilot traveling anywhere for the first time arrive at the decision which airfield is going to be the best to refuel at, taking into account fuel availability, runway length, opening hours and staff, plus the cost to land there.

There must be preferred software or apps which help pilots find out where to fly via, on route to somewhere else. What do people use to make these decisions? Checking out airfield websites would make the task tedious. What are the best alternatives?

Thanks for having me here, everyone! :)
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Colin
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Re: How to plan a fuel stop?

Post by Colin »

I have written a few times about this sort of planning. The short answer is that it is part of your training as a Private Pilot. They will discussion what factors influence those decisions, how to gather the information about your plane, the navigation and weather factors, and the different stops and what they can provide.

My planning, after my initial training, was usually connected to long trips crossing the continent. So I wrote about how to cross. The final portion of that multi-part guide was what I did each day, which is really the part that answers your question. Those guides are now out of date because ForeFlight has really expanded to fulfill nearly all of the roles that several different services did.

I just took a five hour flight from Norwood, MA (KOWD) down to drop the plane at a shop in Salisbury, NC (KRUQ). When I was planning the night before I figured that I would stop at one airport, mostly selected because it was a three hour twenty minute flight to get there, and that's about as long as I like my first leg to be. There was very, very inexpensive fuel on the field and even a Diamond Service center. But then as I was flying along I realized I'd prefer to cut the trip more closely in half and so I dropped into KESN Easton, VA instead. Before I landed I knew the price of gas at each of the FBO's on the field, I knew the runway length and had looked at the airport in a nice three-dimensional view.
Colin Summers, PP Multi-Engine IFR, ~3,000hrs
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DaveS1900
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Re: How to plan a fuel stop?

Post by DaveS1900 »

Rob,
Use this online tool for US airports
https://www.airnav.com/plan/fuel/

For Canada, US and parts of Mexico
turn on FBO fuel detail in the right side panel (click on layers menu)
https://skyvector.com/

Internationally you might try fltpln.com

Dave S.
Ohio
Last edited by DaveS1900 on Sun Dec 04, 2022 4:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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dant
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Re: How to plan a fuel stop?

Post by dant »

Use this online tool for US airports
https://www.airnav.com/plan/fuel/
I want one of these that plans along IFR routes with maximum altitude restrictions. If I had free time I would try and write it myself with the public routing data.
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michael.g.miller
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Re: How to plan a fuel stop?

Post by michael.g.miller »

Since it seems like you're based in the UK, I'll give some Europe specific advice:

- First, I find airports along the route that could serve as potential stops
- Then, I'll check for airport comments (in Europe, this is usually via Skydemon or http://you-fly.com/)
- Finally, I'll check for fuel prices (either World Fuel Services if you have a diesel, or Air Bp if you have a BP Carnet card). ForeFlight might work too, but I've found it to be not as accurate in Europe.

If the airport has good reviews, and a good fuel price, it's likely a good stop, assuming the runway lengths and operating hours check out!

On the other side of the pond (well, in the US anyway!), we are very fortunate. Most airports are open well into the night, have no landing fees, and cheap gas. And if the airport doesn't have cheap gas, there's probably one < 50nm away that does. So stop planning is very easy, and doesn't involve too much hunting.
DiamondRob
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Re: How to plan a fuel stop?

Post by DiamondRob »

Thanks Colin for your informative reply. (I'll reply to the other posts, thank you all, after doing some further reading to bring myself up to speed a little more).

Colin - Im still reading loads of your articles, including those linked to and others Ive found) and haven't finished reading regarding this topic by any stretch, but for now I wanted to chirp up with the following;

Ive just finished reading https://flyingsummers.com/2010/04/30/efb/
You mentioned the mass of charts and the need to buy charts every 6 weeks. And the need for written instructions for landings! 

I only vaguely know what foreflight is/does and try as I might, I wasnt able to deduce from the last paragraph, whether foreflight has become something which can be used so that all those charts do not need to be purchased constantly, has the industry evolved so that one can fly with an ipad, or do pilots still need for any legal reason to be buying paper charts to fly with (and update) all the time. I note the article is more than 10 years old. I know so little, I can only hope your answer is that paper charts are no longer mandatory. Whats the situ today?

Im in the UK, not sure how different applicable mandates are across the pond.
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MackAttack
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Re: How to plan a fuel stop?

Post by MackAttack »

Everything you will need chart-wise is electronic. No paper charts (unless you want them). The G1000 has the charts in them, and your iPad does too. You pay for the subscription to ForeFlight (or Garmin Pilot or whichever electronic flight bag you prefer) and you get the charts. In the newer implementations of the G1000, you can upload your flight plan directly from your iPad to your avionics as well as update your onboard charts that way too.

You still have to learn how to read them though - that’s part of your PPL (and then your instrument rating). The charts are the same; it’s just how you view them that’s different.

Cheers
DiamondRob
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Re: How to plan a fuel stop?

Post by DiamondRob »

michael.g.miller wrote: Sun Dec 04, 2022 1:55 pm Since it seems like you're based in the UK, I'll give some Europe specific advice:

- First, I find airports along the route that could serve as potential stops
- Then, I'll check for airport comments (in Europe, this is usually via Skydemon or http://you-fly.com/)
- Finally, I'll check for fuel prices (either World Fuel Services if you have a diesel, or Air Bp if you have a BP Carnet card). ForeFlight might work too, but I've found it to be not as accurate in Europe.

If the airport has good reviews, and a good fuel price, it's likely a good stop, assuming the runway lengths and operating hours check out!

On the other side of the pond (well, in the US anyway!), we are very fortunate. Most airports are open well into the night, have no landing fees, and cheap gas. And if the airport doesn't have cheap gas, there's probably one < 50nm away that does. So stop planning is very easy, and doesn't involve too much hunting.
Cheers Michael. You-fly looks interesting, thanks for the useful links. Sounds like there are some terrific pro's when it comes to flying in the US!
DiamondRob
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Re: How to plan a fuel stop?

Post by DiamondRob »

MackAttack wrote: Thu Dec 15, 2022 2:40 pm Everything you will need chart-wise is electronic. No paper charts (unless you want them). The G1000 has the charts in them, and your iPad does too. You pay for the subscription to ForeFlight (or Garmin Pilot or whichever electronic flight bag you prefer) and you get the charts. In the newer implementations of the G1000, you can upload your flight plan directly from your iPad to your avionics as well as update your onboard charts that way too.

You still have to learn how to read them though - that’s part of your PPL (and then your instrument rating). The charts are the same; it’s just how you view them that’s different.

Cheers
Thanks MackAttack! Am I right in presuming that to be able to upload flight plans directly from an ipad to a G1000, one would need Garmin Pilot, or does that functionality work with foreflight too. Im not even close to being ready to choosing/using either, just enjoying slowly building beginner knowlege at the moment.
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