gsontheimer wrote:Any one considering the change to all weather plugs at the same time? URHM 38S XL plus a 3/4" harness like Slick Harness M2508R?
PIREP: Tempest Fine Wire Plugs
Moderators: Rick, Lance Murray
-
Lance Murray
- 5 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 1163
- Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2010 11:25 pm
- First Name: Lance
- Aircraft Type: DA40
- Airports:
- Has thanked: 7 times
- Been thanked: 120 times
Re: PIREP: Tempest Fine Wire Plugs
Thats what I did. My harness was looking worn so I changed it all. The all-weather harness seems like a much better design. It may not be necessary at our performance level but I figure every little bit helps.
-
gsontheimer
- 4 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 296
- Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:44 am
- First Name: gsontheimer
- Aircraft Type: DA40
- Aircraft Registration: N937DS
- Airports: EDHL
- Has thanked: 9 times
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: PIREP: Tempest Fine Wire Plugs
Yes, I would like to install the Tempest fine wire plugs, but the 3/-20 variant, not the 5/8-24 type. This also requires a new harness. But I want to be sure, it is Lycoming approved.
Gerhard
N937DS: DA40.992 (2008 XLS)
FAA: ATP, CFI, CFII, MEI
EASA: CPL(A)-IR, FI(A), IRI, FE(A), IRE(A)
Cirrus TCI
N937DS: DA40.992 (2008 XLS)
FAA: ATP, CFI, CFII, MEI
EASA: CPL(A)-IR, FI(A), IRI, FE(A), IRE(A)
Cirrus TCI
-
rwtucker
- 5 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 1283
- Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 11:24 pm
- First Name: Rob
- Aircraft Type: DA40
- Aircraft Registration: N831BA
- Airports: KFFZ KEUL
- Has thanked: 100 times
- Been thanked: 110 times
Re: PIREP: Tempest Fine Wire Plugs
As I mentioned before, I got great results from Tempest fine wires. Easier starts, smooth LOP, more power. However, the results are a fraction of the results I am hearing reported with electronic ignition systems that (a) have their own harnesses and (b) have the power to push massive electrodes to peak performance thereby reducing or eliminating the advantage of fine wires.
Financial metrics will play out differently, depending on the hours you have on your mags, etc. The investment in fine wires is, say, $500. If your mags are close to overhaul ($500), and you need a harness too, it is possible that you might experience a greater per-dollar performance return with an EIS.
Financial metrics will play out differently, depending on the hours you have on your mags, etc. The investment in fine wires is, say, $500. If your mags are close to overhaul ($500), and you need a harness too, it is possible that you might experience a greater per-dollar performance return with an EIS.
-
BlackMammoth
- 4 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 318
- Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:50 pm
- First Name: Phil
- Aircraft Type: DA40
- Aircraft Registration: N29PG
- Airports: KPSP
- Has thanked: 5 times
- Been thanked: 23 times
Re: PIREP: Tempest Fine Wire Plugs
You are aware that Unison / Autolite and Tempest are one in the same? Tempest bought the aviation spark plug business (Unison) from Autolite in 2010.gsontheimer wrote:Yes, I would like to install the Tempest fine wire plugs, but the 3/-20 variant, not the 5/8-24 type. This also requires a new harness. But I want to be sure, it is Lycoming approved.
-
gsontheimer
- 4 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 296
- Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:44 am
- First Name: gsontheimer
- Aircraft Type: DA40
- Aircraft Registration: N937DS
- Airports: EDHL
- Has thanked: 9 times
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: PIREP: Tempest Fine Wire Plugs
Yes, I am.
I am looking for information from the only source that can approve the parts, from Lycoming. In the above Service Information from Lycoming the 3/4"-20 plugs are not listed for the IO-360-M1A engine.
I am looking for information from the only source that can approve the parts, from Lycoming. In the above Service Information from Lycoming the 3/4"-20 plugs are not listed for the IO-360-M1A engine.
Gerhard
N937DS: DA40.992 (2008 XLS)
FAA: ATP, CFI, CFII, MEI
EASA: CPL(A)-IR, FI(A), IRI, FE(A), IRE(A)
Cirrus TCI
N937DS: DA40.992 (2008 XLS)
FAA: ATP, CFI, CFII, MEI
EASA: CPL(A)-IR, FI(A), IRI, FE(A), IRE(A)
Cirrus TCI
-
gsontheimer
- 4 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 296
- Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:44 am
- First Name: gsontheimer
- Aircraft Type: DA40
- Aircraft Registration: N937DS
- Airports: EDHL
- Has thanked: 9 times
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: PIREP: Tempest Fine Wire Plugs
OK. Tempest fine wire plugs are approved by the FAA for the IO360-M1A engine, both the 5/8"-24 variant (UREM38S) and the 3/4"-20 all weather variant (URHM38S).
The file from the FAA is 3 MB. I would have uploaded it here, but I am not allowed over 1 MB.
But what about the slick harness? I have found no harness with 3/4"-20 plugs approved for the IO-320-M1A. And this engine is not listed in the latest Unison/Slick L-1318 Data (Vers. G).
The file from the FAA is 3 MB. I would have uploaded it here, but I am not allowed over 1 MB.
But what about the slick harness? I have found no harness with 3/4"-20 plugs approved for the IO-320-M1A. And this engine is not listed in the latest Unison/Slick L-1318 Data (Vers. G).
- Attachments
-
L-1318G-Consolidated-Application-Data.pdf- (399.84 KiB) Downloaded 148 times
Gerhard
N937DS: DA40.992 (2008 XLS)
FAA: ATP, CFI, CFII, MEI
EASA: CPL(A)-IR, FI(A), IRI, FE(A), IRE(A)
Cirrus TCI
N937DS: DA40.992 (2008 XLS)
FAA: ATP, CFI, CFII, MEI
EASA: CPL(A)-IR, FI(A), IRI, FE(A), IRE(A)
Cirrus TCI
-
Chris B
- 5 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 843
- Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:52 am
- First Name: Chris
- Aircraft Type: DA40
- Aircraft Registration: N171CB
- Airports: KRHV
- Has thanked: 210 times
- Been thanked: 215 times
Re: PIREP: Tempest Fine Wire Plugs
Gerhard sent me the FAA approval file for Tempest fine wire plugs via email, and here is an online link:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_XhlS ... sp=sharing
Chris
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_XhlS ... sp=sharing
Chris
-
gsontheimer
- 4 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 296
- Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:44 am
- First Name: gsontheimer
- Aircraft Type: DA40
- Aircraft Registration: N937DS
- Airports: EDHL
- Has thanked: 9 times
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: PIREP: Tempest Fine Wire Plugs
And here comes the Slick/Champion answer regarding the 3/4" harness to go with the (approved!) URHM38S spark plugs:
"Champion does not have approval for 3/4" harness on the IO-360-M1A engine and Lycoming does not show an approval on their engine drawing. I suggest you get a mechanic to rework the plug ends of our M4004 5/8's harness to 3/4" ends or choose our REM38S plugs which would mate directly up to the M4004 harness."
Strange: Unison has gotten approval on the URHM 38S Spark Plugs with the IO-360-M1A engine but nobody has an approved 3/4" harness to go with the plugs.
"Champion does not have approval for 3/4" harness on the IO-360-M1A engine and Lycoming does not show an approval on their engine drawing. I suggest you get a mechanic to rework the plug ends of our M4004 5/8's harness to 3/4" ends or choose our REM38S plugs which would mate directly up to the M4004 harness."
Strange: Unison has gotten approval on the URHM 38S Spark Plugs with the IO-360-M1A engine but nobody has an approved 3/4" harness to go with the plugs.
Gerhard
N937DS: DA40.992 (2008 XLS)
FAA: ATP, CFI, CFII, MEI
EASA: CPL(A)-IR, FI(A), IRI, FE(A), IRE(A)
Cirrus TCI
N937DS: DA40.992 (2008 XLS)
FAA: ATP, CFI, CFII, MEI
EASA: CPL(A)-IR, FI(A), IRI, FE(A), IRE(A)
Cirrus TCI
-
gsontheimer
- 4 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 296
- Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:44 am
- First Name: gsontheimer
- Aircraft Type: DA40
- Aircraft Registration: N937DS
- Airports: EDHL
- Has thanked: 9 times
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: PIREP: Tempest Fine Wire Plugs
... and here is the follow up from the Slick Technical Support Manager:
"... I have approached Lycoming for a 3/4" harness for this and other applications and have got very little feedback. The plug qualification (from Unison, see above) was a completely separate effort from the engine certification and I assume it was just overlooked in the certification effort. I am working with Lycoming for this and many others which have been overlooked as well but have not made much progress in the last 2 years. I believe the M2508 would work fine on this engine as it is approved for several 4 cylinder Lycoming aerobatic (AEIO & AIO) engines but there is no approval on the M1A."
Whoever flies with a M2508 Slick harness is a test pilot and certainly does not fly a certified aircraft any longer.
"... I have approached Lycoming for a 3/4" harness for this and other applications and have got very little feedback. The plug qualification (from Unison, see above) was a completely separate effort from the engine certification and I assume it was just overlooked in the certification effort. I am working with Lycoming for this and many others which have been overlooked as well but have not made much progress in the last 2 years. I believe the M2508 would work fine on this engine as it is approved for several 4 cylinder Lycoming aerobatic (AEIO & AIO) engines but there is no approval on the M1A."
Whoever flies with a M2508 Slick harness is a test pilot and certainly does not fly a certified aircraft any longer.
Gerhard
N937DS: DA40.992 (2008 XLS)
FAA: ATP, CFI, CFII, MEI
EASA: CPL(A)-IR, FI(A), IRI, FE(A), IRE(A)
Cirrus TCI
N937DS: DA40.992 (2008 XLS)
FAA: ATP, CFI, CFII, MEI
EASA: CPL(A)-IR, FI(A), IRI, FE(A), IRE(A)
Cirrus TCI
-
Steve
- 5 Diamonds Member
- Posts: 1971
- Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2010 1:23 am
- First Name: Steve
- Aircraft Type: DA40
- Aircraft Registration: N432SC
- Airports: 1T7
- Has thanked: 85 times
- Been thanked: 503 times
Re: PIREP: Tempest Fine Wire Plugs
First flight today after changing to the Tempest fine wire plugs. I'd like to say easier to start, but I hadn't flown in over 3 weeks, so the battery was low. After charging, it started up promptly. The engine does seem much smoother at idle, only flew for 0.6 hours. Flying my son back to college on Sunday so will get more time to evaluate.
Steve
Steve