Yet another fuel pump failure on 2003 DA 40

Any DA40 related topics

Moderators: Rick, Lance Murray

User avatar
jwx96
3 Diamonds Member
3 Diamonds Member
Posts: 170
Joined: Mon Jul 22, 2019 9:54 pm
First Name: John
Aircraft Type: DA40
Aircraft Registration: N193JP
Airports: KFCM
Has thanked: 86 times
Been thanked: 44 times

Re: Yet another fuel pump failure on 2003 DA 40

Post by jwx96 »

I think my Dukes fuel pump has failed. When I switched the pump on today there was no sound from the pump and the pump circuit breaker was out. I checked them all in before that as part of my preflight. I reset it and tried the pump switch again and again no pump sound and the circuit breaker again popped out. Is this the way they fail, with the breaker out? My annual was 2 weeks ago, but I've made 2 flights using the pump since then. Is there a chance that this is the result of a loose connection or a crossed wire? If I need a new pump I'll get a Weldon. Also, does it make sense to overhaul the Dukes to keep as a spare? I'm glad this happened at my home airport. 2003 DA40 40.293.
User avatar
Steve
5 Diamonds Member
5 Diamonds Member
Posts: 1953
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2010 1:23 am
First Name: Steve
Aircraft Type: DA40
Aircraft Registration: N432SC
Airports: 1T7
Has thanked: 81 times
Been thanked: 493 times

Re: Yet another fuel pump failure on 2003 DA 40

Post by Steve »

The Dukes pumps have been prone to failure. Often, they start generating RF noise on the radios as a precursor to failure. Having said that, my 2001 Dukes pump is original, and still works fine (now I've jinxed myself). A few years ago I bought a Weldon to keep in the hangar anticipating the original to fail soon...

I might add that my pump only gets used a few minutes on each flight: takeoff until pattern altitude, landing from pattern altitude till on the runway. I don't use it when switching tanks.
User avatar
Rich
5 Diamonds Member
5 Diamonds Member
Posts: 4592
Joined: Mon Aug 30, 2010 12:40 pm
First Name: Rich
Aircraft Type: DA40
Aircraft Registration: N40XE
Airports: S39 Prineville OR
Has thanked: 145 times
Been thanked: 1180 times

Re: Yet another fuel pump failure on 2003 DA 40

Post by Rich »

jwx96 wrote: Thu May 21, 2020 1:00 am I think my Dukes fuel pump has failed. When I switched the pump on today there was no sound from the pump and the pump circuit breaker was out. I checked them all in before that as part of my preflight. I reset it and tried the pump switch again and again no pump sound and the circuit breaker again popped out. Is this the way they fail, with the breaker out? My annual was 2 weeks ago, but I've made 2 flights using the pump since then. Is there a chance that this is the result of a loose connection or a crossed wire? If I need a new pump I'll get a Weldon. Also, does it make sense to overhaul the Dukes to keep as a spare? I'm glad this happened at my home airport. 2003 DA40 40.293.
Since the breaker popped, I'd first be sure there wasn't a short in the wiring. Open up beneath, disconnect the plug and turn on the pump. If the breaker trips the problem is in the wiring external to the pump. I've had a couple of failures, neither popped the breaker.
2002 DA40-180: MT, PowerFlow, 530W/430W, KAP140, ext. baggage, 1090 ES out, 2646 MTOW, 40gal., Surefly, Flightstream 210, Orion 600 LED, XeVision, Aspen E5
User avatar
OriensFlight
3 Diamonds Member
3 Diamonds Member
Posts: 91
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:59 pm
First Name: Hans
Aircraft Type: DA40
Aircraft Registration: N556LU
Airports: KHES
Has thanked: 85 times
Been thanked: 48 times

Re: Yet another fuel pump failure on 2003 DA 40

Post by OriensFlight »

My Dukes failed last December, initially the failure was intermittent, but two flights later is was toast. At around 860 TT, about 400 hrs after the last replacement. I use it for startup, run-up, take-off, landing, and when switching fuel tanks when not within gliding distance of a suitable field. My renters are advised to follow the checklist. :)
Hans
N556LU / 40.763 - 2007 DA40 XL G1000 w/WAAS, SVT, TAS & ADS-B @ RAM Aviation in Healdsburg, California
User avatar
Lance Murray
5 Diamonds Member
5 Diamonds Member
Posts: 1163
Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2010 11:25 pm
First Name: Lance
Aircraft Type: DA40
Airports:
Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 118 times

Re: Yet another fuel pump failure on 2003 DA 40

Post by Lance Murray »

Has anyone here that installed the Weldon pump had an increase in radio RF noise when the pump is running? With the Dukes pump I had no noise. With the Weldon I have enough noise to break squelch on Com 1. It is very irritating and we can't seem to make it go away.
User avatar
Rich
5 Diamonds Member
5 Diamonds Member
Posts: 4592
Joined: Mon Aug 30, 2010 12:40 pm
First Name: Rich
Aircraft Type: DA40
Aircraft Registration: N40XE
Airports: S39 Prineville OR
Has thanked: 145 times
Been thanked: 1180 times

Re: Yet another fuel pump failure on 2003 DA 40

Post by Rich »

Lance Murray wrote: Sat Jul 25, 2020 3:48 pm Has anyone here that installed the Weldon pump had an increase in radio RF noise when the pump is running? With the Dukes pump I had no noise. With the Weldon I have enough noise to break squelch on Com 1. It is very irritating and we can't seem to make it go away.
That was the reason I changed out the first Dukes, many years ago. I assumed it was a harbinger of failure. But I'm still on a Dukes - working for a very long time now. I have a spare Dukes as a talisman 8-)

You might check the grounding. I don't recall the details but when we replaced the first pump we discovered there were more things grounded to a single spot than is recommended standard practice. We rearranged a couple of things. The Dukes didn't always do that, it popped up a couple of years into ownership.
2002 DA40-180: MT, PowerFlow, 530W/430W, KAP140, ext. baggage, 1090 ES out, 2646 MTOW, 40gal., Surefly, Flightstream 210, Orion 600 LED, XeVision, Aspen E5
User avatar
Steve
5 Diamonds Member
5 Diamonds Member
Posts: 1953
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2010 1:23 am
First Name: Steve
Aircraft Type: DA40
Aircraft Registration: N432SC
Airports: 1T7
Has thanked: 81 times
Been thanked: 493 times

Re: Yet another fuel pump failure on 2003 DA 40

Post by Steve »

Rich wrote: Sat Jul 25, 2020 4:25 pmYou might check the grounding. I don't recall the details but when we replaced the first pump we discovered there were more things grounded to a single spot than is recommended standard practice. We rearranged a couple of things.
FuelPump.jpg
There are a lot of grounding straps, as Rich noted. I would check that they are all good connections, no corrosion, etc.

Steve
User avatar
Chris B
5 Diamonds Member
5 Diamonds Member
Posts: 843
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:52 am
First Name: Chris
Aircraft Type: DA40
Aircraft Registration: N171CB
Airports: KRHV
Has thanked: 210 times
Been thanked: 215 times

Re: Yet another fuel pump failure on 2003 DA 40

Post by Chris B »

Lance Murray wrote: Sat Jul 25, 2020 3:48 pm Has anyone here that installed the Weldon pump had an increase in radio RF noise when the pump is running? With the Dukes pump I had no noise. With the Weldon I have enough noise to break squelch on Com 1. It is very irritating and we can't seem to make it go away.
FWIW, a sudden increase in RF noise was the precursor to my Duke's pump total failure. When opened, the motor was completely trashed. Carbon everywhere.

I have had one Weldon failure, but the symptom was a popped breaker. The resistance of the power leads (when removed) was 1/2 of the replacement, so presumably the winding shorted internally.

Chris
User avatar
Ultrapilot1
3 Diamonds Member
3 Diamonds Member
Posts: 118
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:19 pm
First Name: Steven
Aircraft Type: DA40
Aircraft Registration: N446SB
Airports: KPIE KTHA
Has thanked: 20 times
Been thanked: 12 times

Re: Yet another fuel pump failure on 2003 DA 40

Post by Ultrapilot1 »

Wrap the DC wires around a ferrite core 2 or 3 times it can help to reduce the RFI, they absorb the RFI and won't allow it to continue along the wires. It is best to get the ferrite core as close to the pump as possible. You will have to disconnect the wires at some point in order to get them to go through the ferrite core. The core looks like a small doughnut made of carbon. Sometimes it takes more than 1 core to make a difference. You can buy them on Ebay for 10 pcs. $4.
If you disconnect your antenna does the noise go away? If it does that means the noise from the fuel pump is being picked up by the antenna. If it is still there when you disconnect the antenna the fuel pump noise is getting into your radio through the DC power wires. You can also get a RFI noise filter that connects to the DC wiring. Making sure that the grounds are good is important. If the ground wires are on a painted surface they will not make contact.
User avatar
jwx96
3 Diamonds Member
3 Diamonds Member
Posts: 170
Joined: Mon Jul 22, 2019 9:54 pm
First Name: John
Aircraft Type: DA40
Aircraft Registration: N193JP
Airports: KFCM
Has thanked: 86 times
Been thanked: 44 times

Re: Yet another fuel pump failure on 2003 DA 40

Post by jwx96 »

It was the Dukes pump that failed. I replaced it with a Weldon. I am not hearing any RF noise. I got a discount for sending in the Dukes core so I don't have a spare. I hope this one lasts.
Post Reply