Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

The ramblings of our community of aviators.

Moderators: Rick, Lance Murray

User avatar
ScottSutton
3 Diamonds Member
3 Diamonds Member
FIRST NAME: Scott
Aircraft: DA42
Registration: N189Y
Airport: WN53

Posts: 85
Joined: Mon May 18, 2015 3:13 am
Has thanked: 103 times
Been thanked: 8 times

Outdated Garmin G1000 software - petition sign-up

Postby ScottSutton » Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:23 am

This post is directed primarily to DA42 TDI owners. As a long time pilot and now on my third aircraft, this has been such a great airplane! However, the one disappointment has been the glacial pace of updates for the G1000 software. As most, if not all, of the TDI owners know all too well, the last update was all the way back in 2010 with version 9.05. Which must feel like an eternity to more than just me.

According to Garmin technical support yesterday - the current version for the NG model is 15.11 - which offers numerous advantages (to name only a few: Geo-referenced approach plates, data entry and diagramming of non-published holding patterns clearances, flight plan transfer* with Garmin Pilot & Foreflight, high res. terrain, data logging, etc.). Compared to Cirrus Aircraft, which keeps all of their various models completely up to date, Diamond is unfortunately lagging years behind by skirting this type of “across the board” avionics support to our line of aircraft.

Please respond if you're interested in petitioning Diamond to provide us with a Service Bulletin update to version 15.11 software AND OR a hardware upgrade path to the new G1000 Nxi. Even responding with a simple yes to one or both options should suffice, yet providing the aircraft's N number or registration number might also be helpful when eventually our request gets forwarded to Diamond. However, including your aircraft's serial number doesn't seem necessary to me.

Attempting such a request might well be a long shot, yet it seems our OEM is long overdue in hearing from TDI pilot's en masse on this important subject and what's the harm in us trying as a group of concerned owners? Any and all suggestions would be most welcome.

After a discussion period of a week or two, it should become clear whether or not there is enough interest to proceed as a unified group in presenting a formal request to Diamond.

Thanks!

Scott Sutton
N189Y

* because of the composite airframe blocking the bluetooth signal at the LRU rack (discovered during the installation of the GTX-345R transponder upgrade), my avionics shop also installed a flightstream 210 to allow iPad connectivity for ADS-B traffic and Wx.
Last edited by Chris on Sat Nov 10, 2018 2:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
dwall
1 Diamond Member
1 Diamond Member
FIRST NAME: Doug
Aircraft: DA42
Registration: N149WT
Airport: KEDJ

Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Sep 29, 2015 2:48 pm
Has thanked: 4 times
Been thanked: 6 times

Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Postby dwall » Thu Nov 01, 2018 3:02 pm

Scott:

You can count me in for this and thanks for spearheading! I would love to have some of the newer functionality that the Cirrus software has.

Doug Wall
N149WT
User avatar
Colin
5 Diamonds Member
5 Diamonds Member
FIRST NAME: Colin
Aircraft: DA42
Registration: N972RD
Airport: KSMO

Posts: 1218
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 8:37 pm
Has thanked: 99 times
Been thanked: 130 times

Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Postby Colin » Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:15 pm

N972RD is interested in that. I pay $500 a year to Foreflight to keep everything current. I would pay $500 a year to Diamond/Garmin if it meant I could stay on the most current software.

I'm trying to think of what I would pay to get on the new Nxi boxes. $20k?
Colin Summers, PP Multi-Engine IFR, ~2,300hrs
colin@mightycheese.com
http://www.flyingsummers.com
N972RD DA42 G1000 2.0 s/n 42.AC100
N971RD DA40 G1000 s/n 40.508 (traded)
User avatar
CFIDave
5 Diamonds Member
5 Diamonds Member
FIRST NAME: Dave
Aircraft: DA62
Registration: N62DV
Airport: KJYO

Posts: 1469
Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:40 pm
Has thanked: 61 times
Been thanked: 290 times

Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Postby CFIDave » Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:19 pm

I was able to upgrade the now "legacy" G1000 on my DA42-VI (certified as a DA42 NG) to GDU version 15 with all of the additional features you mentioned. But because of the different engines, V-speeds, lack of WAAS, and the KAP-140 autopilot of Thielert/Continental CD-135 DA42 TDIs, substantially changed new software would have to be developed by Garmin and flight tested on a DA42 TDI to reach the GDU 15 level. I'm not sure who would pay for this for aircraft that are now at least 11 years old. And legacy G1000s are "maxed out" at GDU version 15 due to processing limitations.

I think you might have better luck persuading Garmin to develop an NXi upgrade for DA42 TDI aircraft. There might be a financial incentive for Garmin if they could be convinced enough TDI owners would do this. But with the need to replace both non-WAAS GIA63s with new GIA64s, all-new autopilot servos (for GFC700), and the new PFD/MFD screens with much faster processors (and enough profit for Garmin to recover their software development and testing costs), I would guess this might cost $70K or more for an NXi upgrade.
N62DV DA62 62.056
N42DA DA42-VI 42.N117 (sold)
N811ET DA40 XLS 40.874 (sold)
KJYO Leesburg, Virginia
User avatar
cptndavid
3 Diamonds Member
3 Diamonds Member
FIRST NAME: David
Aircraft: DA42
Registration: N16FA
Airport: N87

Posts: 65
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2015 9:59 pm
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 12 times

Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Postby cptndavid » Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:44 pm

I would be interested in a software update. N 16 FA Not so much an NXi upgrade

David
User avatar
ememic99
4 Diamonds Member
4 Diamonds Member
FIRST NAME: Emir
Aircraft: DA42
Registration: SEMAD
Airport: LDZA LDVA

Posts: 255
Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2014 10:31 am
Has thanked: 27 times
Been thanked: 35 times

Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Postby ememic99 » Fri Nov 02, 2018 12:51 am

It’s interesting how some people (usually somehow connected to manufacturer) consider 11 years old aircraft as very old and not worth of supporting. Surprisingly, other airframes are considered as good, even when 30 or 40 years old and eligible for any avionics upgrade. At the same time Diamonds are advertised as reliable and very modern. A bit puzzling, isn’t it? Modern and obsolete at the same time.

There’s very simple answer to question why Diamond allowed this to happen - it’s all related to corporate culture enforced by ex-owner - he was simply interested in your money as long as sales was in process; when completed you were on your own. This is the fact that simply can’t be denied: Diamond neglect their customers and doesn’t support them.

As happy owner of perfectly good DA42 airframe (S/N 42.203, registration SE-MAD) equipped with CD-155 engines, I’m interested in any upgrade available (NXi, GFC700, WAAS) at reasonable price - not like the one asking €400k for two AE300 engines. I guess $50k would be acceptable for GFC700 and WAAS upgrade, including NXi.
User avatar
Colin
5 Diamonds Member
5 Diamonds Member
FIRST NAME: Colin
Aircraft: DA42
Registration: N972RD
Airport: KSMO

Posts: 1218
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 8:37 pm
Has thanked: 99 times
Been thanked: 130 times

Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Postby Colin » Fri Nov 02, 2018 1:48 am

I paid $80k for the GFC700, so I don't think you are going to squeeze WAAS in there with it.

It seems like my bird *should* be close enough to get the v15 software.
Colin Summers, PP Multi-Engine IFR, ~2,300hrs
colin@mightycheese.com
http://www.flyingsummers.com
N972RD DA42 G1000 2.0 s/n 42.AC100
N971RD DA40 G1000 s/n 40.508 (traded)
User avatar
ScottSutton
3 Diamonds Member
3 Diamonds Member
FIRST NAME: Scott
Aircraft: DA42
Registration: N189Y
Airport: WN53

Posts: 85
Joined: Mon May 18, 2015 3:13 am
Has thanked: 103 times
Been thanked: 8 times

Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Postby ScottSutton » Fri Nov 02, 2018 2:58 am

CFI Dave, Colin & emimec99 - All good to know and thank you all for your detailed replies. Even version 15 would be a huge improvement for TDI owners and according to Garmin, anything above version 10 provides substantial benefits after a GTX-345R transponder has been installed. So far we have 5 owners (including myself) who have expressed an interest in a software (only) upgrade. Clearly, we need a lot more TDI owners to join this effort!

Made even more clear, from this tread and elsewhere: is that every legacy G1000 owner now has an orphaned avionics suite. Which in practical terms means the entire fleet with this equipment will become, in time, daytime VFR only aircraft – short of us all having an Nxi upgrade path, expensive as that will be.

In terms of lobbying Garmin, the aviation tech support staff (and others) have repeatedly told me that the responsibility for not only software upgrades and any hardware upgrades, such as the Nxi option - remain solely in the hands of Diamond and all the other OEM's.

Undeterred and taking CFI Dave's advice - I'm trying once again to get in touch with a higher up contact at Garmin, who is out of the office this week. Will report back the details once this conversation takes place. If anyone else has a contact above Garmin Aviation Tech. Support - please chime in. . . .

Thanks very much to all of you who have responded within the last 24 hours!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
By way of background in terms of projected costs that I've heard:

1) Before the Nxi was announced a very talented avionics shop that I've done a lot of business with over the years quoted $25,000 to upgrade the DA42 to WAAS. This seemed a little too expensive for my tastes to simply add WAAS, much as I would like to have LPV capability.

2) With the introduction of the Nxi for the King Air, the same shop ball parked a guess it would cost somewhere around $50,000 to upgrade to the Nxi for a DA42 - if it even became available for “legacy” G1000 systems. Note: there was no discussion of the necessity to upgrade the autopilot from the KAP140 to the GFC700. And if the Nxi will only support the GDC700 A/P, then using Colin's GFC installation numbers, then it's sounding more like a minimum of $130,000 for a yet unavailable upgrade.
User avatar
Colin
5 Diamonds Member
5 Diamonds Member
FIRST NAME: Colin
Aircraft: DA42
Registration: N972RD
Airport: KSMO

Posts: 1218
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 8:37 pm
Has thanked: 99 times
Been thanked: 130 times

Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Postby Colin » Fri Nov 02, 2018 3:50 am

($130,000 was what I put in the plane four months after I bought it. Essentially the money that I got from selling the DA40. Seemed appropriate, somehow. It certainly made it a different plane.)
Colin Summers, PP Multi-Engine IFR, ~2,300hrs
colin@mightycheese.com
http://www.flyingsummers.com
N972RD DA42 G1000 2.0 s/n 42.AC100
N971RD DA40 G1000 s/n 40.508 (traded)
User avatar
ememic99
4 Diamonds Member
4 Diamonds Member
FIRST NAME: Emir
Aircraft: DA42
Registration: SEMAD
Airport: LDZA LDVA

Posts: 255
Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2014 10:31 am
Has thanked: 27 times
Been thanked: 35 times

Re: TDI owners: outdated Garmin G1000 software (version 9.05)

Postby ememic99 » Fri Nov 02, 2018 4:37 am

Colin wrote:($130,000 was what I put in the plane four months after I bought it. Essentially the money that I got from selling the DA40. Seemed appropriate, somehow. It certainly made it a different plane.)


Can you share what you’ve invested in?

BTW I spent a bit more in last three years (€170k) but it includes maintenance from 1000 to 1500 hours, Crosby’s upgrade to CD-155 engines and new scimitar propellers.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests