KHND, Las Vegas (Was: New Forum - Approaches / FBOs)

Your trip reports, airport experiences, etc. are welcome here.

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gtmize
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KHND, Las Vegas (Was: New Forum - Approaches / FBOs)

Post by gtmize »

When flying into "new" airports DA could serve as a valuable aid in flight planning IFR or VFR . Posts on specific airports / approaches / FBO's would be helpful.

I recently few into HND/ Henderson which is inside the B LAS umbrella. HND has two approaches which are both a bit tricky. VOR C a circle to land and RNAV B. B space .. yes its busy with terrain. I was VFR flight following .. the controller vectored me around for traffic away from IAF and finally dropped me. I worked my way in using a visual approach, dodging terrain and landed. Next time I'd pick up an IFR before entering this busy airspace to maintain traffic separation & terrain guidance... or go into Bolder BVU about 30 minutes to the east with more room under the B and better published approaches. Finally I'd comment the personal at the only FBO at HND were LESS than helpful. So . .next time I go to Vegas I'll be using BVU and rent a car.

In my example I'd title the post to the new Forum "HND Vegas"

There may be other aviation websites with information on specific airports approaches.. if so please point me to them.

Thanks,
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Re: New Forum - Approaches / FBOs

Post by Colin »

I am sure I have flown into HND more than two dozen times now. For a while it was the Milk Run for me. There was no real FBO when I was there, it is just the City of Henderson operating a fuel truck and a little lobby.

It took about half a dozen flights before I understood the various routes the approach controllers were having me follow. But then it was all simple as could be. It is much more useful to get in and out of Las Vegas via HND than BVU or VGT, at least for the places I tended to be headed (I am never going downtown or to North Las Vegas itself).

I like the idea of a forum, I would hope that people would cross-post their comments into ForeFlight and AirNav as well. This PiRep stuff is invaluable when you are headed into a new place.
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Re: New Forum - Approaches / FBOs

Post by Chris »

IMO, the Travel / Destinations forum is appropriate for these types of posts. I can improve the forum name, if needed, and move this topic over there if there are no objections.
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Re: New Forum - Approaches / FBOs

Post by AndrewM »

Just as a question that may be a little off-topic, but I hear that the LAX and surrounding airspace is very busy which makes a lot of sense, of course.

I fly through New York airspace relatively frequently, and yeh it gets a little busy at times so you have to be on your toes.

So when I read posts alluding to busy / complex LA airspace, I get to wondering if it is more complex / busy than New York.

Anyone with good experience in both regions have a view? Just curiosity!
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Re: New Forum - Approaches / FBOs

Post by Colin »

I fly both every year. The SoCal TRACON is nowhere near as busy as the stuff in the triangle of JFK EWR and LGA. I think NorCal is actually sometimes more pinched than SoCal when you get between the mountains, some fog, some low clouds and they have SFO, OAK and San Jose arrivals to figure out. LAX is mostly just a big basin and they have a lot of room to move the arrivals around in. Departures are out over the sea, so they never matter.
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Re: New Forum - Approaches / FBOs

Post by Colin »

Both Boston and New York controllers *talk* really fast, although New York is a little faster.
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Re: New Forum - Approaches / FBOs

Post by pietromarx »

I'll also just add that SoCal and NorCal (and LA Center and Oakland Center) controllers are generally *much* more helpful and friendly than either Boston or NY. Las Vegas is much quieter than the other centers.

The airspace in NY is rather less complex than the San Francisco and Los Angeles ones, but there is more commercial traffic packed into less physical area on the East coast. This said, you do have to consider terrain in California. The Bay Area has hills, but SoCal has mountains and they're not to be trifled with.
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Re: New Forum - Approaches / FBOs

Post by CFIDave »

I've only flown IFR through SoCal (LA) airspace twice, but my greater experience with NY controllers has always been positive. They're really sharp.

2 years ago we flew our plane with a group of planes and pilots to the Bahamas and were staying at Bluff House on Green Turtle Cay. While hanging out at the bar we met a group of NY controllers, and of course had to tell them we were pilots who flew there in our DA62. Then last year when we were flying IFR from Martha's Vineyard back home to the DC area, one of the same NY controllers we met in the Bahamas actually recognized us and our DA62 -- so we had a nice chat over the air. Small world!
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Re: New Forum - Approaches / FBOs

Post by pietromarx »

CFIDave wrote:
Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:59 pm
I've only flown IFR through SoCal (LA) airspace twice, but my greater experience with NY controllers has always been positive. They're really sharp.

2 years ago we flew our plane with a group of planes and pilots to the Bahamas and were staying at Bluff House on Green Turtle Cay. While hanging out at the bar we met a group of NY controllers, and of course had to tell them we were pilots who flew there in our DA62. Then last year when we were flying IFR from Martha's Vineyard back home to the DC area, one of the same NY controllers we met in the Bahamas actually recognized us and our DA62 -- so we had a nice chat over the air. Small world!
That's very nice, but I have to assume you're kidding. :)

My many experiences with the controllers around NYC have included things like this:

- "we can't find your IFR plan" (despite multiple confirmations of pre-filed plans)
- "we can't provide flight following" (despite empty frequencies)
- being dropped from basic services pretty much continuously
- not getting called for traffic
- being routed 50 miles around airspace because, well, because

These things rarely happen in other airspace that I fly in, especially on such a routine basis.

And then there are the airline and air crew experiences. After all, these are the same folks who have let planes run out of fuel and fall out of the sky while on holds (you didn't use the "right" word). I have lived in and commuted to/from NY for decades. Even as a passenger, they're not representative of the usual excellent ATC care you find elsewhere.
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