I need some G1000 avionics support in the Phoenix area

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MarkA
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I need some G1000 avionics support in the Phoenix area

Post by MarkA »

We're currently on a trip to Scottsdale, AZ in our DA40 XLS and the G1000 is generating a bunch of strange errors (GPS Data Lost, AHRS failure, ADS-B failure, SVT dropping out, no "TAW System Test OK" or "TAWS System Failure" message on start up, etc.). This has happened three times now so something is definitely wrong

Does anyone have a reference in the Phoenix area for an avionics shop with G1000 experience where i can get this checked out?

The plane is currently at Deer Valley but can be moved to most any airport around Phoenix if needed.

Any help would be much appreciated!
2010 DA40 XLS, N123MZ, KHIO
https://youtu.be/LuQr6mGxffg
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chili4way
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Re: I need some G1000 avionics support in the Phoenix area

Post by chili4way »

Consider talking to the folks at Cutter at Deer Valley and see if their MX operation at Sky Harbor can help you. The Sky Harbor location appears to have Garmin capabilities, although not specific to Diamond. I'm not aware of any Diamond Service Centers in AZ. (The one listed on the Diamond website is really just a flight school.).

Consider calling Diamond Support +1 (519) 457-4041 or Garmin Aviation Support +1 (866) 739-5687. They may be able to suggest a solution or point you to a suitable service location.
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Colin
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Re: I need some G1000 avionics support in the Phoenix area

Post by Colin »

Mark, shoot me email colin@mightycheese.com if you don't find someone. I have a friend who did a panel upgrade to Garmin screens and he loved his shop. I *think* in the Tuscon area, but I can find out if you strike out otherwise.
Colin Summers, PP Multi-Engine IFR, ~3,000hrs
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http://www.flyingsummers.com
N972RD DA42 G1000 2.0 s/n 42.AC100 (sold!)
N971RD DA40 G1000 s/n 40.508 (traded)
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MarkA
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Re: I need some G1000 avionics support in the Phoenix area

Post by MarkA »

Thanks for the quick responses.

I downloaded the G1000 GIA63W maintenance logs and had them reviewed by a avionics shop in the Bay Area (actually Monterey) that I used before.
I think we figured it out. I'll send out the conclusion after we've had a few problem free flights to confirm we understand what likely was causing this intermittent issue.

Stay tuned...
2010 DA40 XLS, N123MZ, KHIO
https://youtu.be/LuQr6mGxffg
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MarkA
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Re: I need some G1000 avionics support in the Phoenix area

Post by MarkA »

The short-form resolution of this issue is to make sure to turn your cell phones OFF to avoid possible RF interference with receiving the GPS signal. The long form is as follows.

Three times in the last month, the G1000 in our DA40 XLS displayed a bunch of error messages. These included AHRS failure, GPS Data Lost, SVT failure, TAWS failure, a transient ADS-B failure message, etc. One event happened while taxiing and the other two were in the air - fortunately in clear weather.

Basically it appeared that the two GIA-63Ws stopped reporting GPS data so anything that depended on GPS position information failed. Everything else appeared to be working fine (NAV/COM radios, airspeed, altitude, engine instruments, etc.).

During the second in-air event, the failures messages appeared three times for a short period then everything came back up on its own and seemed to be working fine. This was confirmed by looking at the track log from the upper right SD card which indicated no GPS data was reported for 7 seconds, 1 min 17 seconds, and 45 seconds respectively during that flight. These GPS outages corresponded roughly to the three times G1000 errors were reported.

The three things considered that might cause this behavior included:
  • the GPS satellites went down – unlikely since no GPS outages were reported
  • the two GPS antennas/cables/GIA-63Ws had an intermittent hardware problem. It seems highly unlikely they’d both fail at the same time. I also dumped the maintenance logs for both GIA-63W and no hardware related errors were reported.
  • there was some other radio frequency (RF) interference that prevented the GPS signal from getting through.
While downloading the maintenance logs for the GIA-63Ws, I noticed there are all kinds of warnings in the G1000 System Maintenance Manual troubleshooting tips about making sure there are no cell phones or devices that use cell phone technology in the cabin. Specifically read through sections (5-45), (5-49), (5-53), and (5-76).

It turns out that each time the G1000 error messages were reported, both my wife and my cell phones were on sending/receiving txt messages (including photos) at the same time since we were both in the same txt groups. I normally leave my cell phone on in flights, and have never seen an issue but the unique situation here was that we had TWO phones on that were sending/receiving relatively large amounts of data simultaneously.

I confirmed this hypothesis with Adam Mitchell at https://www.aerialavionics.com/ who has done a lot of G1000 work on DA40s. He indicated he had heard of and witnessed cell phone use causing intermittent issues with G1000 aircraft in the past. His comment was that “It is sorcery why sometimes it happens when most of the time it’s no issue.”

On the return flights from Scottsdale, AZ to Hillsboro, OR we turned our phones off and didn’t see any issues. Note this doesn’t conclusively establish cell phone RF interference caused the problem but without additional data, for now that’s my story and I’m sticking with it!
2010 DA40 XLS, N123MZ, KHIO
https://youtu.be/LuQr6mGxffg
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Colin
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Re: I need some G1000 avionics support in the Phoenix area

Post by Colin »

“It is sorcery why sometimes it happens when most of the time it’s no issue.”
So confusing.

We often have four cellphones on in the cockpit, particularly right before landing (my sons' scope the meal, my wife is checking in on work, I am obviously posting to the blog on short final).
Colin Summers, PP Multi-Engine IFR, ~3,000hrs
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N972RD DA42 G1000 2.0 s/n 42.AC100 (sold!)
N971RD DA40 G1000 s/n 40.508 (traded)
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Colin
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Re: I need some G1000 avionics support in the Phoenix area

Post by Colin »

What sort of phones?
Colin Summers, PP Multi-Engine IFR, ~3,000hrs
colin@mightycheese.com * send email rather than PM
http://www.flyingsummers.com
N972RD DA42 G1000 2.0 s/n 42.AC100 (sold!)
N971RD DA40 G1000 s/n 40.508 (traded)
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MarkA
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Re: I need some G1000 avionics support in the Phoenix area

Post by MarkA »

Phones are nothing special - Android Motorola Moto G7 and Huawei Honor 7x.
2010 DA40 XLS, N123MZ, KHIO
https://youtu.be/LuQr6mGxffg
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Re: I need some G1000 avionics support in the Phoenix area

Post by rwtucker »

This is good to be on the lookout for. I use my phone quite a bit with Bluetooth linked to my headset. I don't think I have had an interference issue.

I loved your Tillamook video. We had friends with a house in Pacific City and flew over from time to time. TMK was our choice because I was unwilling to use PC's 1,800 ft. airstrip.
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Re: I need some G1000 avionics support in the Phoenix area

Post by Boatguy »

My phone is always besides me on the seat wedged between the seat and the hull. When my wife is with me hers is also on. I've never had this issue in 500hrs in the DA40NG.

You are probably correct that it's an RF problem, but it may not affect all DA40/42s because there is a difference in the Faraday cages around the G1000. My understanding is that older DA40's have a very different box than the newer planes.
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