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Re: Engine overhaul time - Lycoming IO-360-M1A

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 10:37 am
by krellis
Highly recommend Penn Yan. Oldest engine overhaul facility in the Country.

They have IRAN’d both of my “new” engines for the experimental RV’s I’ve built.

Great folks to work with and highly experienced. Like everyone, parts availability can be a challenge, but PYA has a lot of resources to pull from.

Re: Engine overhaul time - Lycoming IO-360-M1A

Posted: Fri May 13, 2022 10:52 am
by mhoran
That was my original plan. Looks like they're still quoting $33,600 for an overhaul. Not sure on timing, back in April it was four months. Probably longer now. Edit: still 15 weeks.

Unfortunately it might make more sense to sell the plane if we have to overhaul. The WAAS upgrade and subsequent avionics issues has emptied the piggy bank. I was thinking we still had a few more years before an overhaul would be necessary. But will wait to hear back from SouthTec abut next steps...

Re: Engine overhaul time - Lycoming IO-360-M1A

Posted: Mon May 16, 2022 11:53 pm
by mhoran
Savvy recommended I reach out to Watson Aero in Louisville, GA. So far they have come in with the best price and timeline: $32k for new cylinders, $31k for overhauled cylinders, 12 week turnaround. They'll try to order new cylinders if I wish and if they won't meet the timeline they'll use overhauled cylinders. If I fly the plane down to them they'll do the install for $2,500 plus a few other parts. I'll plan to do this if the plane is airworthy, otherwise we'll have to crate it up.

Still hoping for a miracle but it sure doesn't seem likely.

Re: Engine overhaul time - Lycoming IO-360-M1A

Posted: Thu May 19, 2022 4:53 pm
by mhoran
Some good news, potentially useful for others as well. Unless the oil analysis or borescope suggest otherwise, SouthTec proposed having the overhaul shop order cylinders now and continue flying for a couple months while we wait for parts to come in. This will minimize downtime and keep me flying in the meantime. I'll be down for about a month instead of three, if all goes well. Oil analysis and borescope will be the determining factors here.

Re: Engine overhaul time - Lycoming IO-360-M1A

Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2022 8:27 pm
by mhoran
I dropped my plane off at Watson Aero two weeks ago. I wasn't sure if I was going to be able to make it as there were thunderstorms for about a week straight and I was about to leave for a two week work trip which would have delayed the start of the overhaul. However, the stars aligned and the thunderstorms surrounded but did not interfere with my flight path. I shot an easy LPV approach into 2J3 and then James Watson, owner of Watson Aero, drove me to Augusta so I could catch a flight back to NYC.
PXL_20220819_154203511.jpg
On the way I picked up a replacement exhaust collector from SouthTec in NC to be installed during the overhaul. I also ordered a Tanis engine heater kit and the parts for RSB40-094. All this will be done by James during my overhaul. He's also going to be sending out my prop, governor, and oil cooler for overhaul.

James managed to get a new set of Superior Millenium cylinders for me, which should address the oil consumption issues I was having. I'll also be having a new camshaft installed, with the new "Diamond Like Carbon" or DLC coating. This is an alternative to switching to roller tappets (which can only be done by the factory) and is believed to have the same effectiveness at reducing premature wear associated with Lycoming's top mounted cam.

I was told that my camshaft was shot, which is likely the source of the magnetic filings that were found at overhaul. I'm glad to have confirmation of the issue, and it's good that we went ahead and scheduled the overhaul. I was told when I initially scheduled the work that I'd be down for 12 weeks. It's been 2 now, so hopefully I'll be flying again in November. I'll keep you all posted!

Re: Engine overhaul time - Lycoming IO-360-M1A

Posted: Tue Sep 06, 2022 8:28 pm
by Charles
Earlier in this thread, I reported non-magnetic metal shavings in the filter at my annual in May. I went back for an oil change last week and the mechanic declared my engine non-airworthy due to a loud banging noise coming from one of the cylinders (which I had not noticed). He opened the valve cover but could find nothing wrong so he suspects a connecting rod bushing might be involved. My initial thought was to get the 1996 SNEW engine overhauled but shops are still reporting 12-16-week lead times so we will investigate the repair option a little further.

Re: Engine overhaul time - Lycoming IO-360-M1A

Posted: Tue Sep 06, 2022 9:30 pm
by dmloftus
While I have hopefully a few years before an overhaul, I see quotes for Lycoming Factory Rebuilt IO-360's for $35-40K. What is the calculus of having your own engine rebuilt with potentially months-long delays vs swapping for the factory rebuild that can be accomplished in a few weeks? Would you have more confidence in the quality of a Lycoming factory rebuilt than the rebuild shops listed in this thread? Also, would the resale value of the plane reflect the incremental value of a factory rebuild vs aftermarket?

Re: Engine overhaul time - Lycoming IO-360-M1A

Posted: Tue Sep 06, 2022 9:34 pm
by mhoran
Factory rebuilds / overhauls are taking 30 weeks+ (and even missing those dates). If you don't need an engine *now*, that's a great option. Unfortunately overhaul of your own engine is the only practical option otherwise.

You can't even buy Lycoming cylinders at the moment; Penn Yan doesn't even offer a new cylinder option, only overhaul of your own. I managed to get a set of Superior Millenium cylinders, since I made a down payment three months ago. Other Lycoming parts are procurable, but have long delays.

The time issue for the smaller overhaul shops (and I presume even Penn Yan) is repair of the crankshaft / case. That is the bulk of my downtime, since the parts were already ordered.

Re: Engine overhaul time - Lycoming IO-360-M1A

Posted: Tue Sep 06, 2022 9:55 pm
by dmloftus
mhoran wrote: Tue Sep 06, 2022 9:34 pm Factory rebuilds / overhauls are taking 30 weeks+ (and even missing those dates). If you don't need an engine *now*, that's a great option. Unfortunately overhaul of your own engine is the only practical option otherwise.
I guess I have more to learn. BTW, I wasn't referring to Lycoming rebuilding one's own engine, which I understand would be a very lengthy process. I was under the impression from companies like Air Power that you can pay them $40K for a "new" factory remanufactured engine plus a refundable $20K core charge that you get back when you turn in your original. That way you can fly your own engine until your "new" engine is delivered and do a much faster swap.

https://www.airpowerinc.com/henpl-rt10051

Re: Engine overhaul time - Lycoming IO-360-M1A

Posted: Tue Sep 06, 2022 9:58 pm
by mhoran
Yeah, that's what I'm referring to. From when you order to delivery is taking 30+ weeks. I was also surprised when I started looking into this. It wasn't even presented to me as an option.

I suspect the overhaul own / exchange situation has always been a matter of timeline; just that the timelines for both have slipped significantly, due to the supply chain issues and shop backups.