Diamond Pilot Proficieny Course

[Mwarmer]

I am a member of several flying associations.
The American Bonanza Society (ABS), the European Bonanza Society (EBS), and the Diamond Pilots Association (DPA).
Every year, I diligently complete the Annual Pilot Review to keep my licence current.

The way we fly (usually with two persons and some luggage), the values indicated in the manual of the airplane are not correct. These values are based on the MTOW (maximum take-off weight). But with two persons, these are not the correct values.

The ABS offers various courses to help you gain better control of the aircraft. There is an initial course, an initial Beechcraft systems and techniques-based training, a Shorter, recurrent training to build on what you learned in the BPPP (Beechcraft Pilot Proficiency Program).

The EBS offers Pilot Safety Training. I took this course three times when I was still flying a Beechcraft Bonanza A36. This four-day course is truly exceptional. You learn all about the aircraft. Everyone who comes here is wildly enthusiastic.

At Diamond, there is NOTHING. Yes, you can take a course at Diamond. But it is not a group course where you can exchange ideas with like-minded pilots. And yes, there are various videos on YouTube, but that is not a course.

Can anyone tell me whether this could be set up or supported by Diamond or the society?

[Ed McDonald]

You are correct, there is no formal training material for Diamond aircraft. Diamond does not produce any and some of the third party material out there is lacking. And, the third party material is strictly systems, not flying training or proficiency.

The Diamond PIlots Association (DPA) would like to develop training and proficiency material however being a volunteer organization we have a limited amount of resources (time and money) to create this. Perhaps in the future sometime.

[Boatguy]

I think the ABS is also a volunteer organization, as is COPA, though both draw on larger fleets. I think if DPA began just a basic new owner (new plane or new to the owner) onboarding/orientation program it would deliver more value to owners than expending limited resources trying to convince Diamond to change any of their customer support policies.

[Mwarmer]

Thank you for your reply.

I am eagerly awaiting a Diamond course, which will explain in practical lessons why the Diamond flies the way it does.
For example:
- What is the take-off distance in the current configuration?
- What is the minimum braking distance in your current configuration with half tanks and two people? That is not the braking distance stated in the manual.
- Can you make precision landings?
- What is the stall speed in the current configuration? If that stall speed is 55 kts, try flying at a height of 1 m above the runway at a speed of 56 kts. Can you still turn from the left side of the runway to the right side of the runway? This is not about showing off, but is called aircraft control.
- From what height can you make the ultimate turn into the runway? Does the configuration have an influence on this?
- Can you make a precision landing with a 5° approach without the speed getting too high?

And I could ask ten more questions that are not in the flight manual, but which do occur in practice.

Why are these not supported by Diamond?

It's not just about selling an aeroplane, but also about providing the best pilots.

[tjmoody]

You bring up some very good points here. It’s just a fact that the Diamond community currently lacks some of the training resources available for other types. In some cases the manufacturers developed training but in most cases it does seem to be the independent owner groups that develop it e.g. ABS, COPA, CJP etc.

Diamond, like any manufacturer, is in a tricky situation with respect to what they can put in their documentation since it all needs to go through lots of certification. Hence the value in having independent pilot/owner organizations. As Ed says, DPA has other focuses right now … taking this on is a huge amount of work … but as an MEI training exclusively in Twin Diamonds, I definitely share your view in the value of this.

In the meantime, I think the best resources are at flight schools that train in Diamonds (Twin Diamonds in your case). In my case I learnt to fly twins at a school that exclusively trained in DA42s. Some of the instructors there had hundreds if not thousands of hours in Twin Diamonds and had a lot of knowledge to share. There are a handful of training organizations in the US that have DA62s and hence are good resources for that model.

I would point out that you can determine the answer to your first two questions about take off distance and braking distance by interpolating data in the tables. Pages 5-11 to 5-34 in the DA62 AFM have take-off distances for a wide range of take-off weights and configurations. Of course if your exact take-off weight is not in there it is acceptable to interpolate. Similarly, pages 5-64 to 5-87 have landing distances for a wide range of weights and configurations. I hope this helps.

[Mwarmer]

Thank you for this detailed message.
Fortunately, I have been able to attend the Pilot Safety Training course offered by the European Bonanza Society on several occasions. This association is run entirely by volunteers.
The chief instructor of this association, who also teaches the course, flies a Bonanza F33 himself. During the training, he explains the difference between the theoretical values in the manual and the values that you can interpolate.

However, there is a difference between the theoretical value and the value that YOU can fly. These are nice figures, but if you are not capable of flying these values, they are useless. The values in the manual have been flown by highly experienced Diamond pilots. Most of us are not that experienced, nor are we professional pilots.
Practice is more difficult. At the EBS Pilot Safety Training, the first day is spent discussing the theory and the manual. Most of us have not read this manual in its entirety, or have barely read it at all.

After the theory, you will fly with a professional pilot for four hours over four days, to help you understand the aircraft better and give you a feeling of greater control. You won't learn this at a flying school, because they are only concerned with explaining the “new” aircraft to you.

So, I would very much like to spend a few days sparring with highly experienced Diamond pilots in order to gain better control of the aircraft.

[Ed McDonald]

I think the ABS is also a volunteer organization, as is COPA, though both draw on larger fleets. I think if DPA began just a basic new owner (new plane or new to the owner) onboarding/orientation program it would deliver more value to owners than expending limited resources trying to convince Diamond to change any of their customer support policies.

ABS: 10,000 + members (https://www.bonanza.org/about-us/mission/)
COPA: over 6,600 members (https://www.cirruspilots.org/)
DPA: 217 members

Considering DPA has been around for only 2 years and there are way more Beech's and Cirrus's out there, we are not doing too bad. But with our limited financial and volunteer resources we cannot do it all and have to prioritize. And my personal priority is not having to replace perfectly good parts at 600 hours and 900 hours and an entire engine at 1800 hours as well as being able predict failures for safety purposes using engine data from the Austro.

I can't speak for the other Diamond dealers but the Canadian one sends all of their DA62 customers to my outfit for a proper DA62 conversion course.

[Boatguy]

I think the ABS is also a volunteer organization, as is COPA, though both draw on larger fleets. I think if DPA began just a basic new owner (new plane or new to the owner) onboarding/orientation program it would deliver more value to owners than expending limited resources trying to convince Diamond to change any of their customer support policies.

ABS: 10,000 + members (https://www.bonanza.org/about-us/mission/)
COPA: over 6,600 members (https://www.cirruspilots.org/)
DPA: 217 members

Considering DPA has been around for only 2 years and there are way more Beech's and Cirrus's out there, we are not doing too bad. But with our limited financial and volunteer resources we cannot do it all and have to prioritize. And my personal priority is not having to replace perfectly good parts at 600 hours and 900 hours and an entire engine at 1800 hours as well as being able predict failures for safety purposes using engine data from the Austro.

Four years ago Austro disclosed internal projects to extend the TBR of the injectors to 1,800hrs, and produce a new flywheel, cylinder head, crankshaft seals, connecting rods, and wiring harness. They also announced that NXi Phase III s/w would be available to all NXi equipped Diamond's by the end of 2022.

Have they provided DPA with updates on any of those projects? Is there reason to be believe those projects were abandoned?

I completely understand the benefits of "on condition" maintenance as used by commercial jet engine manufacturers. However, it's challenging to believe that DPA's 217 members can influence Austro, EASA, FAA and TC to move to a "predictive" and "on condition" maintenance model for Austro engines when Mike Busch has tried for years, and thus far has failed to accomplish that for tens of thousands of Lycoming and Continental legacy engines with far more data and an investment in AI analysis of the data.

If DPA can influence the priorities of Diamond/Austro's certification resources, I suspect that the NXi s/w upgrades, as well as an avionics roadmap for G1000 owners (how to get out of the "certified avionics" trap), are probably a higher priority for most owners than extending the Austro TBR from 1,800 to 2,000.

With respect to DPA resources, in early 2021, Diamond asserted that the global fleet was 5,000-6,000 airplanes (they provided both numbers). GAMA reports the sale of another 1,004 Diamond aircraft from 2021-2024. That suggests the fleet size by the end of 2025 is in the range of 6,250 - 7,000.

DPA has captured 217 members or about 3% of the fleet. In 2020, DAN had about 1,600 registered users, roughly 30% of the fleet in 2021. That suggests that DPA has a roughly 10x upside on membership.

Maybe DPA should consider making member recruitment the top priority of its limited resources. More members creates a virtuous cycle of more volunteers which enables more member benefits and services which in turn helps attract more members.

[Musty206]

Hi everyone,

The timing of this conversation thread is seems serendipitous. Diamond Aircraft has been actively working on a new/recurrent training program for owners who are transitioning or interested in becoming more familiar with their aircraft. The "Diamond Brilliance Training Program" will be fully deployed by the beginning of the new year. The course will be administered by well-qualified and experienced flight instructors who operate and service all models of the product lineup. This is a "factory approved" program and will provide participants with a Training Certificate upon completion of the course.
Please stay tuned while we finish the final legal requirements to bring this endeavor to fruition.

[waynemcc999]

Hi everyone,

The timing of this conversation thread is seems serendipitous. Diamond Aircraft has been actively working on a new/recurrent training program for owners who are transitioning or interested in becoming more familiar with their aircraft. The "Diamond Brilliance Training Program" will be fully deployed by the beginning of the new year. The course will be administered by well-qualified and experienced flight instructors who operate and service all models of the product lineup. This is a "factory approved" program and will provide participants with a Training Certificate upon completion of the course.
Please stay tuned while we finish the final legal requirements to bring this endeavor to fruition.

Good stuff, Trevor! Does this mean that someone at Diamond Aircraft actually reads DiamondAviators.net and maybe Diamond-Pilots.org? That'd be quite refreshing and much appreciated.
Thanks,
Wayne